Mk6 Golf and EGR valve issues

Scruffydog

2009/59 GOLF 1.6tdi - bought approved used from VW main dealer two years ago and serviced by them on time since. Just 35k miles and the dreaded EGR failure - cruise control light and start up coil on the dash lit up and car lost power. Took to VW - pointed out that this problem is rife with this engine and Loads of posts all over the Internet - see here,VW forum, Audi forum, Skoda forum (they all use this engine too). EGR is a regular failure at 30-40k miles - gets clogged up. VW came back to us "that will be £1260 sir" ......seriously are you kidding me? 35k miles and a £1200+ bill for a non service item failure? I complained to VW customer service and they state they could get no good will from the factory and that its down to the dealer to offer any discount (to be fair they offered 50%) but regardless this is still £630 for a faulty part - not a random failure - just google it. I'm having to pay as need the car for work but will be making a complaint.

nervousnovice

Very impressed (notwithstanding that the replacement valve should not have been necessary) with Noodle52 (post 156) and his bill of £420 all in. The price quoted for the valve alone is £268.27 plus VAT plus gaskets and labour.

But what stands out is the 2.5 hours it took a local garage to do the work, compared to VW's trained technicians who take (well at least charge for) at least 5 hours.

How can they take twice as long ?? Oh, I forgot, you do get a 'complimentary wash and footwell vacuum'.

Looking through the posts, it seems that VW's policy is to charge as much as they can get away with, rather than charging a fair price for the job.

tomekent

tomekent wrote: »

Background: VW Golf SE 2009 1.6 tdi, 35k miles, bought 3 months ago privately (for about £8k). My first nice car

So my car's been running sluggish for the past couple of weeks. Stuttering in bottom end of 3rd/4th gear. Just over a week ago the coil light flashed on and then never returned. I took it to an independent garage, told them the problem and left it with them. They plugged it in and found no fault codes at all, nothing. They said it could be a whole range of things and they didn't want to just throw my money at it. So, if it was to happen again, bring it in and hope their's a code. (They didn't charge at anything and were very helpful)

So I spent the following week trying to 'internet diagnose' the problem - ranging from possible fuel filters to the DPF. Took it for a long drive at high revs to possibly clear it out.

Then last night it properly broke down (limp mode I guess), pulled over, called the AA.

AA man came out and decided it was the EGR valve (as he'd seen it countless times). He 'blanked' off the valve and it started straight away. Was enough to get me home and hopefully to the garage next week.

So I rang up my independent dealer and he said just take it to the main VW dealer as they may offer good will etc.

I rang up the main dealer and explained the situation: suspected EGR valve replacement. Got a quote for £510 labour (5hrs) + roughly £500 parts. I went on to ask them about goodwill payments etc based on it being a common problem. They said to book it in for a diagnostic (which I have) @ £102. They'll send a report off to VW to see if they'll help towards the parts/labour.

Now I know this report is based on factors such as service history, milage, age etc. So hopefully my car will be ok. I bought it privately 3 months ago, but the previous owners bought it from, and got it serviced at, the same garage I'm taking it to. So hopefully that works in my favour.

From what I can tell, based on my phonecalls with the VW garage, my independent and VW customer care, the goodwill payment on their side is usually just for the part. Any money off the labour is most likely fronted by the garage itself. So if you're a regular it might help.

Its booked in for next thursday so we'll see what happens and I'll keep you updated.

UPDATE:

So took the car to the VW dealer this morning. It almost didn't make it, had to keep revving it up at the traffic lights, white smoke coming out the engine bay and felt like I was going to stall.

Well I got a call about half an hour ago saying they've done their diagnostics and there is nothing wrong with the EGR (at least there were no 'codes logged'). Instead he said there was a problem with the Mass Air Filter (MAF). This will cost about £250 inc parts to change (the part should get there by tomorrow).

Now this seems plausible to me as the MAF and EGR are all in that little exhaust/air flow system so one could interfere with the other. In fact I think the MAF tells the ECU which tells the EGR valve to open/close etc.

The AA man thought the EGR valve was stuck open so had to disconnect the whole air filter system to get to the EGR valve to close it. This could of 'reset' the MAF sensor and let the car start and get going.

On the other hand it could be the EGR is screwed and as a result is making the MAF doing crazy things such as throwing errors. The VW guy said there were no errors for the EGR, but I'm still somewhat convinced its the EGR (partly due to how similar my problem sounds to others in this thread). So it might be a throw £250 at it to only come back and be the EGR. If so I hope that works in my favour to try and get some good will from VW against the EGR problem.

Fingers crossed the MAF replacement fixes it and I'll have my car back by the weekend. Will keep you updated.

teresa43

Not wanting to be the harbinger of bad news, we've been through the MAF bit before.It seems these cars are clever, but not that clever.

When our car first started misbehaving we took it to our local garage. The fault codes said MAF fault, so they replaced it (just under £200 inc.)

We never had any EGR fault codes either, which is why we were then charged £300 for another garage to check timing belt etc trying to find the fault. Even though we had two separate mechanics at separate times prove the EGR was at fault by blanking it off, nobody wanted to believe it.

Now that the offending part has finally been replaced the car runs perfectly. But if you need the car for the weekend, buy an EGR blanking plate on eBay for £3.99. It fits on one end of the shiny pipe that exits the cylinder head and goes into the inlet manifold (seen from on top of the engine). It's a fiddly job, but doesn't take long.

tomekent

I'm fairly convinced its the EGR valve too. But I really don't know what to do, when I spoke the VW guy on the phone he wasn't terribly helpful. He was just reading the diagnostic report, so only really commented on what was written down. Which is what annoys me about modern cars, everyones a technician rather than a mechanic, reading codes off the ECU.

When I booked it in for its diagnostic test I said to specifically check the EGR valve as I was confident it was that. He said no error codes and they checked it and it was ok. He did however tell me things about the tyres and windscreen wipers :mad:. I wanted them to properly check the EGR, I don't care about the stuff I can check myself.

However, I'd rather replace the MAF to find out its the EGR then the other way around.

My question is, at what point do they decide its the EGR? If it never shows any codes does is it just an expensive process of elimination?

teresa43

It does seem to be a long process, nobody wants to admit it's the more expensive fault. They may further try the "coked up throttle control module" ruse before finally admitting defeat (been there).

It's a modern malaise: rather than using skill and experience to diagnose a problem, everyone's looking at a screen and just accepting what "the system" is telling them.

tomekent

Its been about two weeks since I first took it to a garage complaining of stuttering. They found no codes at all. So something between then and now has caused the MAF sensor to log a fault. Possibly the break down the other day, where the AA man took the whole air filter part out to get to the EGR?

Some people on this thread have reported that the EGR logs a fault. So I don't know if mine should or not. I went into the garage this morning fully expecting them to tell me its the EGR, replace it and charge me £1k, so this has thrown me off.

Out of interest teresa43 how much did it end up costing you? Did you get any goodwill etc?

I'm also aware that this is a thread devoted to EGR faults so a lot of people are posting their EGR valve stories. On the other hand I can't find the big thread devoted to MAF problems

teresa43

We did have a MAF fault code from the beginning, but I think its a red herring. Removing the air filter box shouldn't effect it.
Because it was less than six months since we bought the car from a reputable dealer, it just took time and some heavy emails until they accepted they had to replace the EGR. So it didn't cost us anything, although the process of running around to find the fault and all the false diagnosis has cost a lot in garage fees and lost time at work.

tomekent

The time is more of an issue, my partner is a nurse so she works weird and wonderful hours 25 miles away so can't rely on public transport. We've rented a car and the bill for that will reach £200 by this weekend.

Its going end up being being expensive whatever I do. The most annoying thing is that I can't even prevent it. 35k miles, 5 years old full service history. No error codes. I might have been better off if I'd crashed the car.

Either way hopefully I'll find out tomorrow.

daymanc

@Scruffydog - i'm surprised that your local VW garage didn't help more. They should have at least replaced the EGR valve for free and charged up to 50% for labour as have a few other people on this thread. I would look to complain further when you go to settle the bill as the EGR in my opinion is not fit for purpose and not designed to last as long as the engine life.

@tomekent - similar issue to me with the MAF springing up error codes. After they had 'fixed' this issue they assured all was well. 15 minutes after picking up the car, same 'limp mode' symptoms. I'm suspecting that your EGR is the root cause and if not now at some point in the near future will need replacing.. I'm still certain my local VW garage suspected an EGR fault initially and didn't want to go down that route until I sent the car back in with a very angry look!