Disgusted by Manchesters Congestion Charge Proposal

iwanttosave_2

black-saturn wrote: »

Yes thats because they get stuck in traffic because theres too many cars on the road.

No its because they set off late, stop for a fag ect.

black-saturn

Well they might but I still think it's worth not paying the congestion charge for. I've never been able to get a seat in a London bus but they are still managing with a congestion charge.

pault123

black-saturn wrote: »

Yes thats because they get stuck in traffic because theres too many cars on the road.

and exactly how is this since they have dedicated BUS LANES!!!

Markyt

black-saturn wrote: »

Well I've been there several times (travelled there by public transport from suffolk) and used a really good tram system when I got there

That would be the one thats currently shut down for 6 weeks along one line due to essential maintenance.

pault123

Edinburgh have the right idea! Let me submit this to you, courtesy of paul smith and the late Dr Alan Werninck.

"We do not see congestion as a severe problem in Edinburgh but such congestion as there is could be alleviated by:-
1. Reopening roads previously closed off;
2. Removing obstructive "traffic calming";
3. Limiting bus lanes to routes where there is adequate road space;
4. Widening roads and putting in new roads as needed;
5. Building a sufficient number of easily accessible, low-cost multi-storey car parks near the city centre, streaming traffic towards and away from them and servicing them with shuttle buses between them crossing the city centre."
There are other views on congestion and what might be done about it. Some of the possibilities include encouraging people to walk, cycle or get the bus. People can also be encouraged to car share. None of these are easy to do, but for instance the councils could set up and administer a car share service, where they matched people who wanted to share (Fife Council have started a trial scheme, which is not yet open to all).
Diesel engined buses and lorries can of course cause more air pollution than petrol driven cars, but this is an area where the government at Westminster could encourage and enforce better controls such as particulate traps.

Tolls do little to reduce congestion as for most drivers the car is the most convenient "vehicle" for the journey they wish to make at the time that they wish to make it. Drivers will try and avoid the toll while still using the car, this may mean that they actually make longer distance journeys to detour around the toll zone boundaries.
Where the driver can't bypass the toll, they will consider making a different journey, i.e. they will go to shops and other facilities that are away from the tolled area.

:beer:

anewman

Think I should point out that public transport is *not always* slower than driving. My sister's partner lives in Leeds and works in Huddersfield. He walks to the train station, probably a 10 minute walk, then catches a train which generally takes about 21 minutes to get to the destination (although often these trains are delayed), but the alternative can be a 1 hour plus drive using the M62 each way. It also saves parking hassle. So even though he owns a car he buys a west yorkshire metro pass which is quite expensive considering. So not all people would be at a disadvantage using public transport.

Just thought that was a fair point to make with most comments here suggesting that Public transport puts you at a time disadvantage with driving.

DKLS

anewman wrote: »

Think I should point out that public transport is *not always* slower than driving. My sister's partner lives in Leeds and works in Huddersfield. He walks to the train station, probably a 10 minute walk, then catches a train which generally takes about 21 minutes to get to the destination (although often these trains are delayed), but the alternative can be a 1 hour plus drive using the M62 each way. So even though he owns a car he buys a west yorkshire metro pass which is quite expensive considering. So not all people would be at a disadvantage using public transport.

Just thought that was a fair point to make with most comments here suggesting that Public transport puts you at a time disadvantage with driving.

Ahh the joys of the Trans Pennine Express- I used to catch that one for more than 10 years. My usual commute could be summed up with:
Arrive at Hudds Train station and see Train pull in usually 4 carriages, usually at least 4-8 mins late, now train would be already half full as it picked up from Manchester and stalybridge, and there was enough people on the platform to fill another 4 carriages. So you pile on the train, and fight for a seat, if its one that stops at Dewsbury, 8 times out of ten they had no chance of physically squeezing on the train, so had to wait for the next. And the same on the way home, yet even worse, a platform full of people wanting to get home, and if your lucky 4 carriages would pull in, usually 2 or 3 would turn up.
And I guarentee travel off-peak, and there will be carriages galore, If we had a cheap, clean efficient transport system, it may become a viable alternative for car drivers.

anewman

DKLS wrote: »

Ahh the joys of the Trans Pennine Express

I used to catch it too leeds to huddersfield and back for 3 years for university but didn't own a car at that time. I can confirm it's not brilliant and trains often late, too few carriages etc. In fact I was once stuck in the middle of nowhere on one of these trains for almost an hour when I had a meeting at University to attend, very inconvenient. Also once or twice the train took a different route through wakefield kirkgate, which takes longer, but there was no prior warning. Although recently some new Siemens trains have been introduced on this line but this is after I finished university.

Suppose it depends on whether you prefer the inconsistency of public transport or being stuck in traffic with your car idling away burning petrol plus the cost of parking or hassle of driving around to find free parking with a guaranteed longer length of time to get to work and back home, with the benefit of your own space and music.

siamese0109

anewman wrote: »

All you have to do is give someone a lift into leeds, got to be someone going that way very close to you doing the whole 9-5 thing and isn't a complete loser.

I would! .....but unfortunately I don't work a standard day so could never guarantee a time for car share. My job involves me being out and about most of the day and I can never say what time I'll actually be finished. I'm just waiting to see what happens with the conjestion charging - working for the council makes it seem a bit ridiculous having to pay to enter the city centre and I go through that 3 or 4 times a day. Also waiting to hear more on the tax for having a parking space in the city centre.................or is that a whole new thread???

ic

http://www.gmfuturetransport.co.uk/home.php

Take a look at the map - the trains run in and out of the city. If like me you want to go ten miles along the motorway - train isn't an option. A 25 minute drive takes 90 minutes on the train or bus because of having to wait in a station in the middle. Public transport in the South of Manchester is abismal - and their own maps prove it!

Stockport desperately needs the A555 SEMMS bypass, but thats just been turned down on cost - and now the local Labour MP (whos constituency isn't actually affected by the bypass) is now suggesting it be a toll road instead!!!! :mad: