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SSE raises energy prices 8.2% just before winter....again.

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Comments

  • Fella
    Fella Posts: 7,921 Forumite
    1,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Thrugelmir wrote: »
    What was Millibands contribution

    ....to anything at all when Labour were in power? Other than being one of Brown's inner clique.
  • grizzly1911
    grizzly1911 Posts: 9,965 Forumite
    CLAPTON wrote: »

    the regulator OFGEM (i.e. the government) decided that there was no need to determine the price but to leave it to the market

    there is no law of nature that says energy must be 'affordable'.

    so the government does indeed affect the market in major ways

    If the government is guaranteeing the future price of supply to attract investment it is dictating minimum customer pricing. AIUI the future guaranteed price for nuclear is substantial. Without that guarantee there will be no investment. Asking China to finance our requirements is going to cost us, will we as a country be able to afford it? It is ironic that free market capatalism can't provide the answer but a communist state may.

    You are right there is no right to affordable energy. government should clearly make that point and prepare for the consequences.
    "If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....

    "big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham
  • grizzly1911
    grizzly1911 Posts: 9,965 Forumite
    edited 17 October 2013 at 10:00PM
    coastline wrote: »
    Looks like the best bet for customers is switch to a fixed rate deal now before any further rises...even if it is with the same supplier.I'd doubt any duel fuel switch would save over £100 a year in general with the main companies taking in direct debit etc.
    If the government were serious in helping the customers then maybe they could remove the 5% Vat for a period of time...
    Although this won't happen the cost to the Treasury looks less than £2bn a year...the link below is 2011.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/8779242/Rise-in-gas-bills-will-net-Treasury-200m-VAT-windfall.html
    By all means switch if it will save money. If you are already using fixed tarrifs,ddrs,online, have an efficient home, then it is just switching escalators and the step off at the end may be a lot bigger than expected.

    If too many switched the companies would simply withdraw the tariff. Davey and Cameron are simply sidestepping the issue with the lame switch recommendation.
    "If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....

    "big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham
  • chucky
    chucky Posts: 15,170 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    edited 17 October 2013 at 10:31PM
    Fella wrote: »
    ....to anything at all when Labour were in power? Other than being one of Brown's inner clique.
    I wonder when the die hard Tory supporters will stop blaming the previous government for the issues they should be dealing with right now; 10, 20, 30 years. It's been 3 and a half years now and they're still blaming others. Shameful.
  • CLAPTON
    CLAPTON Posts: 41,865 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    If the government is guaranteeing the future price of supply to attract investment it is dictating minimum customer pricing. AIUI the future guaranteed price for nuclear is substantial. Without that guarantee there will be no investment. Asking China to finance our requirements is going to cost us, will we as a country be able to afford it? It is ironic that free market capatalism can't provide the answer but a communist state may.

    You are right there is no right to affordable energy. government should clearly make that point and prepare for the consequences.

    We live in a mixed economy: no free market economy anywhere in the world.

    There would be investment but different investment.

    The market is saying there is no need for nuclear power as they believe there will be cheaper power in the future.


    PFI all over again.
  • grizzly1911
    grizzly1911 Posts: 9,965 Forumite
    CLAPTON wrote: »
    We live in a mixed economy: no free market economy anywhere in the world.



    The market is saying there is no need for nuclear power as they believe there will be cheaper power in the future.


    PFI all over again.
    The market believes there will be cheaper energy in the future. Very comforting. More profitable short term options perhaps. Any idea where they think this manna from heaven will be found, next to the fairy and black pudding animal at the bottom of the garden.

    There is little appetite for long term investment in any field. Short term return only. Demand for "affordable" energy is not going to fall whether we will have income to afford it longer term, in volume, is the issue.
    "If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....

    "big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham
  • Joe_Bloggs
    Joe_Bloggs Posts: 4,535 Forumite
    edited 17 October 2013 at 10:33PM
    One of the reasons that the UK has to pay Winter rates for gas is that the suppliers have no incentive to store cheap gas in the Spring and Summer months to cope with the Winter demand. If Germany/France can store close to 100 days worth then why is the the amount in the UK around two weeks ?.

    This puts the UK energy supply at the mercy of other sovereign nations who may wish to exploit their energy supply influence. There is a continuing threat of Russia cutting supplies to Ukraine. Ukraine cuts supplies to the European Union etc.. These threats only materially effect those without sufficient storage.
    J_B.

    http://news.sky.com/story/1145326/centrica-shelves-1-5bn-gas-storage-plans

    Perhaps the governments of today and tomorrow in the UK should grow up and realise that energy security is a national security issue and cannot be left to the existing monopolistic players.

    J_B.

    PS
    I doubt the Energy regulator can influence Électricit! de France. I am not sure what the the share percentage the French state still holds.
  • grizzly1911
    grizzly1911 Posts: 9,965 Forumite
    Joe_Bloggs wrote: »
    One of the reasons that the UK has to pay Winter rates for gas is that the suppliers have no incentive to store cheap gas in the Spring and Summer months to cope with the Winter demand. If Germany can store 122 days worth then why is the the amount in the UK around two weeks ?.

    This puts the UK energy supply at the mercy of other sovereign nations who may wish to exploit their energy supply influence. There is a continuing threat of Russia cutting supplies to Ukraine. Ukraine cuts supplies to the European Union etc.. These threats only materially effect those without sufficient storage.
    J_B.

    http://news.sky.com/story/1145326/centrica-shelves-1-5bn-gas-storage-plans

    Perhaps the governments of today and tomorrow in the UK should grow up and realise that energy security is a national security issue and cannot be left to the existing monopolistic players.

    J_B.

    PS
    I doubt the Energy regulator can influence Électricit! de France. I am not sure what the the share percentage the French state still holds.
    I wonder how much of that "cheap" German stored gas gets sold into the market, when we need it, at a premium?
    AIUI they will only release UK stored gas once the price reaches a suitable premium too.
    I wonder how many times that gas gets exchanged and profit taken whilst in storage?
    "If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....

    "big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham
  • CLAPTON
    CLAPTON Posts: 41,865 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    The market believes there will be cheaper energy in the future. Very comforting. More profitable short term options perhaps. Any idea where they think this manna from heaven will be found, next to the fairy and black pudding animal at the bottom of the garden.

    There is little appetite for long term investment in any field. Short term return only. Demand for "affordable" energy is not going to fall whether we will have income to afford it longer term, in volume, is the issue.

    I didn't say I had any idea about future prices;
    what I'm saying is the energy (nuclear) suppliers are not confident they will make a profit over the next 30 years or so:
    I conclude that is because they fear there will be cheaper sources of energy.
  • CLAPTON
    CLAPTON Posts: 41,865 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Joe_Bloggs wrote: »
    One of the reasons that the UK has to pay Winter rates for gas is that the suppliers have no incentive to store cheap gas in the Spring and Summer months to cope with the Winter demand. If Germany/France can store close to 100 days worth then why is the the amount in the UK around two weeks ?.

    This puts the UK energy supply at the mercy of other sovereign nations who may wish to exploit their energy supply influence. There is a continuing threat of Russia cutting supplies to Ukraine. Ukraine cuts supplies to the European Union etc.. These threats only materially effect those without sufficient storage.
    J_B.

    http://news.sky.com/story/1145326/centrica-shelves-1-5bn-gas-storage-plans

    Perhaps the governments of today and tomorrow in the UK should grow up and realise that energy security is a national security issue and cannot be left to the existing monopolistic players.

    J_B.

    PS
    I doubt the Energy regulator can influence Électricit! de France. I am not sure what the the share percentage the French state still holds.



    I would guess, but in truth don't know, that their government forces them to hold that level of storage
    the UK government makes no demands on the suppliers: there is no requirement for the energy companies to ensure security of supply.
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