PCN from private company which work paid. Can work ask me to pay it?

goonarmy

So i have a company car which i overstayed in a car park which takes photos on enetry and exit. So we know it was an overstay. 45 quid charge which has been paid by my employer. They emailed and wrote to me to ask if they can deduct it from my wages. I werent up for that cos if it were my car i doubt id be paying anyway. Can work ask me for it? Ive taken zero ation yet. And theyve asked me again if tbey can take it this month.

Stroma

You need to look at what your contract of employment says, and the company policy on their fleet is. We can't offer advice on the first, the second I would say that that involves fines,penalties and congestion charges, this is none of these.

Can I just say that if its not on any employment documents, they would be making an unlawful deduction from your salary. You need to educate your fleet manager on this scam. And you need to make a decision on how to handle this.

Coupon-mad

goonarmy wrote: »

So i have a company car which i overstayed in a car park which takes photos on enetry and exit. So we know it was an overstay. 45 quid charge which has been paid by my employer. They emailed and wrote to me to ask if they can deduct it from my wages. I werent up for that cos if it were my car i doubt id be paying anyway. Can work ask me for it? Ive taken zero ation yet. And theyve asked me again if tbey can take it this month.

Almost certainly NO. They have fallen for a fake parking ticket. Will they pay if I send them one too, mentioning any car in their fleet?! Are they that stupid?

goonarmy

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Almost certainly NO. They have fallen for a fake parking ticket. Will they pay if I send them one too, mentioning any car in their fleet?! Are they that stupid?

Certainly not a fake parking ticket. Fake parking fine maybe. But thats by the by. Id not pay it but aint my car and wssnt my choice to pay it. Sounds like i need to check my contract.

Stroma

goonarmy wrote: »

Certainly not a fake parking ticket. Fake parking fine maybe. But thats by the by. Id not pay it but aint my car and wssnt my choice to pay it. Sounds like i need to check my contract.

Of course it's a fake ticket! Are they issuing this under statute law ? Are they a council? Are they the police ? The answer is no in each case, which means this is an invoice requesting payment, no matter how they dress it up, no matter their threats, this is not a parking ticket! So it's a fake, like their whole barrel scraping industry

zzzLazyDaisy

All of the above is true, but it still depends on the employers policies and procedures.

Any company that provides company cars to its employees should have a company car policy. The employee should sign the policy to confirm that they agree to comply with the terms and conditions. Those terms and conditions should make it clear that it is the employees responsibility to park appropriately, safely, and lawfully, and to comply with any conditions or restrictions of parking. It should also make it clear what happens in the event of a parking fine/charge or notice of prosecution being received. There would normally be a deductions clause, either in the contract, in the company car policy, or in a separate document, which the employee has signed.

Since this employer is asking permission to deduct the money for the wages, it sounds as if they have not properly set up the necessary procedures.

In law, Now that the alleged debt has already arisen, it is too late for them to obtain permission to deduct, as the written consent must have been obtained before the debt arose.

Note - I am speaking as an employment lawyer here. Provided the employer has put in place the necessary procedures and obtained the necessary signatures, they are perfectly within their rights to pay the charge on behalf of the employee and deduct the money from their wages.

Coupon-mad

Yes but the contracts we have seen on other threads in the past, only say a company can pay parking 'fines & penalties from an authority'. This one is a fake PCN.

I think it depends on what the OP's car use contract says in terms of defining what can be deducted, do you agree zzzLazyDaisy?

Stroma

The problem is on this is the same as a few nhs ones we've seen, and that is they could put pressure on you as the employer, it may not be legal but people feel their jobs are at risk for a small amount of money.

It's very difficult to offer advice in these situations, we know the company is wrong in paying, but people fear that their jobs are at risk. At the end of the day all we can do is offer the advice and let the OP decide what to do

zzzLazyDaisy

Coupon-mad wrote: »

I think it depends on what the OP's car use contract says in terms of defining what can be deducted, do you agree zzzLazyDaisy?

Absolutely. The bottom line is 1) the policy must define what it identifies as a debt (eg something that the employer pays on behalf of the employee and expects to be reimbursed) 2 the employee must have signed a document (usually, but not always, the contract of employment) which gives the employer the right to deduct money owing to the employer and 3) the employee must have signed the document containing the deductions clause before the debt arose.

This sequence of events must be followed before a deduction is lawful, but with that proviso, The contract/policy can state that any parking charges (whether private, local authority, or police) will be paid on behalf of the employee, so they pay the reduced charge, and deducted from their wages.

And lets face it, with the ongoing erosion and removal of employee rights, most people are going to 'put up and shut up', rather than rock the employment boat.

EDIT - of course if they get a windscreen ticket they can choose to appeal. I know the advice is wait for the NtK, but where there is an uncooperative employer involved, possibly putting your head above the parapet as a driver is better than letting the employer pay?

The_Slithy_Tove

zzzLazyDaisy wrote: »

And lets face it, with the ongoing erosion and removal of employee rights, most people are going to 'put up and shut up', rather than rock the employment boat.

zzzLazyDaisy wrote: »

EDIT - of course if they get a windscreen ticket they can choose to appeal. I know the advice is wait for the NtK, but where there is an uncooperative employer involved, possibly putting your head above the parapet as a driver is better than letting the employer pay?

Absolutely! This forum always recommends appealing directly to the NtD in the case of company, lease and hire cars, where the RK is some anonymous company, whose droids who receive the NtKs are ignorant of how properly to handle them.

goonarmy

Stroma wrote: »

Of course it's a fake ticket! Are they issuing this under statute law ? Are they a council? Are they the police ? The answer is no in each case, which means this is an invoice requesting payment, no matter how they dress it up, no matter their threats, this is not a parking ticket! So it's a fake, like their whole barrel scraping industry

This is not a fake ticket.

Impossible.

You need to know the difference between a fine and a penalty charge notice. Do you have any of the info ive asked for?