Appealing the Bedroom Tax

ab.da54

mysterywoman10 wrote: »

Private adaptations are different as I said very few SOCIAL SERVICES OT's will agree to stairlifts. It is not to do with funding.

Not from my experience of talking to people who have had adaptions, which include stairlifts.

mysterywoman10

ab.da54 wrote: »

And if in general, someone has difficulty getting upstairs once or twice a month, but are fine the rest of the time?

Surely, someone would find it quite difficult using a sofa bed when joints are so bad that stairs are difficult, so using a TV in the bedroom, where the bed is higher than the sofa bed, would make sense.

Is there little point though, when occupational therapy can provide a stair lift, if there is substantial need?

If a family are finding it difficult to pay the extra housing benefit, they could move to a two bed house if one was available, they could move to a flat, or a bungalow, depending on what is available, or they can stay where they are. They don't 'need' a bungalow specifically and they can also do other things if a move isn't on the cards.

I think you need to make your suggestions to the original poster not to me as I said I'm not debating people's personal circumstances especially when they are not here.

I asked a couple of questions and said "sounds like" you need a bungalow and would have waited until they came back before saying anymore.

princessdon

Anny wrote: »

I was answering to this hypothetical scenario. No disabilities, capable of work on JSA Yet you reply :-

hmm except

A) I am not fit and able. I am ill and eligible for support group
I have a disabled child who can't use a blow up bed
C) I am a carer for a disabled adult



Are you now talking about the parent in the scenario or yourself? - confused.

I was mixing the two up, as you originally referred to me, for that I apologise, I will stick to hypothetical situations.

I could be wrong but it appears you are now talking about yourself, yet again, in the reply to this post. You gave a scenario I answered it so it must be you that is eligible for the 'support group', you have mentioned this many times before, so I presume it is? I had no knowledge of you having a disabled child

I have mentioned my child a lot of times, given how much you appear to read my posts, I can't think why this comes as a surprise

but do remember you saying you had cancelled DLA for the niece who lives with you now. With regards to the niece you did say in one or more post you got no financial help whatsoever for caring for her and yet in another of your 'scenarios' a few days ago, you received kinship allowance.

Yes, I didn't want to embarrass someone by pointing out what so called "subsistence levels" are for parents, so I said "if I was on means tested benefits I would get this". At present due to means testing I don't. If I was on Income Support I would. I would get CB/CTC and a small kinship allowance, it's approx £23 a week here.

So I do get very confused with your posts and apologise if I have got it all wrong. I know you care for your nan so perhaps the above is you. To be honest I never know if you are speaking about a fictitious character or yourself - it is very confusing.

If it is you above/reply post to me and you are not fit and able to work then you need to make some choices and you are lucky if you can still make those choices. Many of the disabled people I work with do not have/ did not have that choice - they cannot work - full stop. Maybe you are not at that stage yet but only you can decide that and that must be your choice. Many people seem to presume they are eligible for ESA support group but I thought until you have applied and been given the award there is no certainty...unless you have a terminal illness then special rules apply.

I know I hit a descriptor - No certainty, of that I have no doubt, but I have hundreds of medical reports that list word for word a descriptor that places automatic entry into support group.

I do not support everyone who comes under the DDA and never said I did. The people I work with are all severely disabled and although I am aware of the wide range of disabilities that are covered by the DDA the children and adults that I have worked with are ,like I say, severely disabled.

If, due to disability, a person 'needs' an extra room be it because they cannot sleep with their partner, they only have occasional overnight care, but can prove they 'need' that care or they 'need' to store disability aids wheelchair, mobility scooter, oxygen, ect. Then they 'need' that extra room and should be able to prove they 'need' that extra room.

It was you Princessdon who spoke of human rights in regard to not living with your husband full-time. I presume that was sarcasm?

Yes it was sarcasm- The issue for needing a spare room is disability, not family rights

The rights of family to 'spend' time together is not what is being discussed here though is it? to try to compare the two issues seems pointless, they are not comparable.

The other poster did, he said moving people away from support was against human rights as a family.

Often, through peoples choices families do not get to spend time together but that is a choice.

Agreed

People who are disabled and need an extra bedroom due to the reasons above, that is not a choice but a 'need' - often families do not spend time together due to working far in excess of what they really need

agreed - hence my sarcasm

and that is due to 'greed'. Human rights does not cover for those who choose financial reward (working away, working excessive hours, in order to have an high-standard of living) over the need for family time - lets not confuse the two - one is 'need' and the other is 'greed'!

No it's not always greed, those in the military, fear of job loss, lack of a safety net on benefits, lack of opportunities make it closer to need not greed. In fact you could argue for someone to refuse a job and remain on benefits because they don't get home by a certain time is greed.

I trust all the above answers your questions

I'll guess a few hours max.

panther_87k

ab.da54 wrote: »

And if in general, someone has difficulty getting upstairs once or twice a month, but are fine the rest of the time?

it is more like once a week.

Surely, someone would find it quite difficult using a sofa bed when joints are so bad that stairs are difficult, so using a TV in the bedroom, where the bed is higher than the sofa bed, would make sense.

it is a sprung metal action sofabed and is no lower than some normal beds, but it is mainly used in the sofa position, sitting/lying in bed all day is not comfortable or healthy for him.

Is there little point though, when occupational therapy can provide a stair lift, if there is substantial need?

they wont supply one, as he doesnt need it all the time just sometimes

If a family are finding it difficult to pay the extra housing benefit, they could move to a two bed house if one was available, they could move to a flat, or a bungalow, depending on what is available, or they can stay where they are. They don't 'need' a bungalow specifically and they can also do other things if a move isn't on the cards.

there are no 2 bed houses available, and there is a VERY long waiting list for housing so we would not be a priority if there was anything suitable available as we already have housing. bungalows are reserved for those in wheelchairs and the elderly round here.

i did see someone mention DLA, he was turned down because he can walk a certain distance on a "good" day even if he is in severe pain and discomfort when doing so.

also, mutual house exchanges here never seem to work out, it may get so far but then it always falls through, i dont personally know of any that have worked out round here. i will look into it though, its worth a look to see if there is anything suitable.

hope i didnt forget anything in response to all who have replied to me.

cheers

princessdon

Morlock wrote: »

There is no certainty whatsoever. Princessdon has read the descriptors and decided that because some of them might possibly apply her, she would definitely qualify, but chooses not to claim. The reality is a lot different, as many claimants who presumed they would qualify, do not.

It sounds very selfless to claim to qualify, but not do so for 'moral' (or whatever) reasons, it adds a bit of credibility when supporting policies that are generally against those who do claim.

Where do you get that logic. I am also sure I can claim JSA Cont Based if made redundant, does that make me selfless?

It's nothing to do with morality, I work so I can't claim out of work benefits, simple fact really. People can be eligible for a group without claiming, this is based on their disability, nothing to do with morality. Take someone with no NI conts and their partner works, so cannot claim IR. They are eligible, yet don't claim, you can easily be eligible for something without claiming, why you think this is a moral issue I don't know.

My mother doesn't claim her pension - is it morality or because she works?

What it means is that I do understand disability, just because I work doesn't mean I have no difficulties, many of us do.

If you doubt my claim perhaps one of the posters who know my condition can confirm my statement is completely true, I know Muttley is one, would need to dig out PM's for the other. I queried it as I could not believe it gave auto entry to support group, it does.

You can't win on here at times. Lets say I am now unable to work, if I claimed ESA, in addition to my husbands salary, my private and work pensions, my insurance for ill health which would give a rather vast monthly income, I'd be flamed anyway, just like people did with DC. You can't have it one way then another.

But yes when it comes to disability benefits, I don't think everyone should claim because they CAN, I think they should consider work (where they can, some can't), I think those with lower care needs that are met by themselves or family shouldn't claim. It's why I never claimed AA for Gran until she needed to pay for care, as every penny would have went into her bank, not one pence spent on her disability as it is care based and was provided for free. As we would never take a penny petrol, she would have not needed a penny of it, it seems wrong to me.

Likewise with my eldest, I meet her needs and has no additional costs, IF this changes and I have to pay (Eg we may need to pay for her physio) then I will claim. It's not morality, its because they don't need the money that is allocated for extra needs, if it was needed, I would claim.

Can't really claim I take the higher ground when I created the claim for my Gran, would be very hypocritical

Dunroamin

angrybuffalo wrote: »

I see. a £14 a week loss is a lot to lose from what remains a low income for a family of 4 - regardless what percentage of income it is. As a point of accuracy, it is nearer 5.5% of his disposable income than 3.5% - you have added in the housing benefit, which pays his landlord, and is not available income. remember, he has to use his available income to make up the shortfall in his rent - he can't use the rent money to do that!

Although many claimants don't like to accept it, HB/LHA/CTB is part of their income, just as the money paid for a mortgage or rent by someone paying these for themselves are.

princessdon

Dunroamin wrote: »

Although many claimants don't like to accept it, HB/LHA/CTB is part of their income, just as the money paid for a mortgage or rent by someone paying these for themselves are.

I must admit when I took a pay cut I never said.

I lose X% of disposable income, I lost X% of my wage. My wage being needed to pay my mortgage and Council tax and all bills. It's one pot of money.

I guess it is alien to those whose housing are paid by the state that they don't see this an income, when you work it's part of your income as needs paying.

Dunroamin

ab.da54 wrote: »

As an aside, mysterywoman, is angryubuffalo your husband, by any chance?

Exactly what I've been thinking - when I haven't been thinking them to be the same person.;)

mysterywoman10

panther_87k wrote: »

i did see someone mention DLA, he was turned down because he can walk a certain distance on a "good" day even if he is in severe pain and discomfort when doing so.

also, mutual house exchanges here never seem to work out, it may get so far but then it always falls through, i dont personally know of any that have worked out round here. i will look into it though, its worth a look to see if there is anything suitable.

hope i didnt forget anything in response to all who have replied to me.

cheers

All the best Kristy I hope things work out for you and YOUR family will be thinking of you. x

ab.da54

ab.da54 wrote: »

As an aside, mysterywoman, is angryubuffalo your husband, by any chance?

mysterywoman10 wrote: »

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

Ah well that's my signature done for the day

Dunroamin wrote: »

Exactly what I've been thinking - when I haven't been thinking them to be the same person.;)

The response to my question was quite telling

Not that it matters, I was just wondering.