Add your feedback on energy supplier Sainsbury’s Energy

pearl123

davethorp wrote: »

Did your deposit request come on your welcome letter or a separate letter? I've received a welcome letter with no mention of a deposit and trying to work out if I've got through or not

I had two separate letters. The first requesting a deposit and the second which arrived a couple of days later a welcome.






The irony is Sainsbusy requested an deposit yet I had been a British Gas customer for longer than I could remember!


I did not switch, as I was unimpressed.

davethorp

Looks like I got through then as I've only had the welcome letter. My noddle score is 1/5 which just adds to the bizarreness though as someone with a 5/5 score has been asked for a deposit although the scores generated by CRAs are pretty meaningless as this demonstrates!

Despite my low score I've not had credit problems for about 5 years and have a number of well managed accounts with decent limits in the last 3 years

Level_Head

As you know, Sainsbury have won the latest MSE energy auction - however, there appears to be a problem:

Put simply, the unit rates by Sainsbury (in partnership with British Gas) to induce the commitment to switch, and as quoted on MSE's Web site, may NOT be the same for you as those coming through on your contract confirmation from Sainsbury.

That's exactly what I found and if it is different for me, then it is probably different for thousands of others, including possibly you.

Naturally, you would expect the unit rates to be the same - namely, one simply confirming the other. However, I have found that not to be the case and the differences (for me) are certainly significant.

Remember, it is the unit rates confirmed directly by the energy supplier that matter, although you can probably hold them to the rate quoted when you made the commitment on MSE because that is when the contract was made.

For example, in my case, when I went to check the unit rates I had recorded on Screen shot from MSE with the rates contained in the contract I received today from Sainsbury, I found them to be quite different, as below:

1. The TCR rates in the contract received today .v. from MSE are materially incorrect:

Electricity: 11.74p pkwh .v. 10.79p pkwh - that's 8.8% out !?! :eek:

Gas: 4.02p pkwh .v. 3.90p pkwh - that's 3.1% out !?!

2. Less significantly, but nonetheless it goes to gauging the extent to which Sainsbury is (or is not) on the ball, whereas Unit rates across all price and energy segments were quoted from MSE to 3 decimal places, the contract is to 2 decimal places! The norm for energy is to 3 decimal places.

So, there it is. I have spoken to Sainsbury who are "looking into the matter" and promise to get back to me over the next 2 days. They have received an email copy of my Screen shot (as an attachment in Word - more legible) - but, I wonder how many took a Screen shot of their rates from MSE?

If one person has this problem, then it's probable that I am far from alone - check your contract, check with Sainsbury, and check back here in 3/4 days when I hope to have posted the reply back from Sainsbury.

Level_Head

Hi [Level Head]
Thanks for your email.
I've checked the figures and can see that the difference here is around how VAT has been added (whether using a rounded figure or full decimalised figure).
In terms of TCR, the difference is that on your application page, the rate quoted is based on your actual usage, whereas on your welcome letter this is based on average UK usage of (13,500kwh gas and 3,200 kwh elec).
I hope this helps.
Thanks
Dan [Cheap Energy Club]...

[FONT=&quot]Hi Dan,[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Thank you for your comments, although I have to say from reading your comments that we may be at cross-purposes here on the facts:[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]1.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] The Sainsbury generated [/FONT][FONT=&quot]unit price tariff rates contained[/FONT][FONT=&quot]on the MSE Screen shot taken from the MSE platform on February 11, and that I retain, are clearly stated to be inclusive of VAT.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]2.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] The [/FONT][FONT=&quot]unit price tariff rates [/FONT][FONT=&quot]on the Sainsbury contract confirmation received today are also clearly stated to be inclusive of VAT. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]3.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] Therefore, factual points 1 and 2 above would appear to be fundamentally at odds with your decimal point and TCR feedback comments. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Apples do appear to have been correctly compared with apples. The unit price tariff rates between 1 and 2 above are not the same and, obviously from the course of dealing, they should be.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Indeed, Sainsbury confirmed that as correct with me on the telephone today when they went through my emailed MSE screen shot rates (the rates, as contracted with Sainsbury on February 11 in my case) with their contract confirmation data received today by this household. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]4. [/FONT][FONT=&quot]The unit price tariff rates were offered on February 11 based on latestactual annual gas and electricity consumption inputted by this household on the MSE platform. The unit price tariff rates are not “average” rates. They are fixed rates given as offered by Sainsbury on the MSE Web platform – for this household to contractually accept or reject. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]In this instance, the offer was obviously accepted on February 11 by this household.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]5.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] The unit price tariff rates set out in the contract I received today from Sainsbury are reasonably expected to confirm and be consistent with the unit price tariff rates set out on the MSE platform used by Sainsbury on February 11, as also used to induce this household into the contract.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The unit price tariff rat[FONT=&quot]es[/FONT] set out in the contract confirmation received today from Sainsbury [FONT=&quot]should be[/FONT] the rates that will be applied across all consumption billings over the specified term, and quite irrespective of the actual consumption that transpires in the same time frame. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]As with the contract, the "Tariff Type" specified by Sainsbury is also "Fixed" - no variation.[/FONT] The deal was clearly held out on February 11 by Sainsbury on the MSE platform as a "Fixed Tariff" over a "Fixed Term" - that is the ordinary meaning of those words in English.

[FONT=&quot]The bottom line here is that Sainsbury must stand by their bargain with this household as struck on February 11, a[FONT=&quot]longside[/FONT] [FONT=&quot]everyone[/FONT] else who signed up, [FONT=&quot]and as[/FONT] specified by them on the MSE platform. That, after all, is the contractual position.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Thanks.[/FONT]

Chissy

I am pleased to see I am not alone :(:(:(:( as I was really worried something bad had happened to my hard earned credit history - but now I am just angry at Sainsbury's Energy.

I did the switch request online via the Energy Club and have just received a letter from Sainsbury's Energy for each utility. The letters state that they have checked my credit history and (as I confirmed with a phone call to them) they require £90 'deposit' for electricity and £125 'deposit' for the gas before they will supply.

The chap on the phone said my credit history meant that they required this 'deposit'.

I am NOT happy, I have excellent credit. The chap on the phone suggested I check my credit with Experian, which I did straight away. It is rated as 999/999 - the top score.

Either Sainsbury's Energy (from British Gas) has made an error or something underhand is going on?


Dear MSE, this ain't good enough. What do you think? :mad:

davethorp

Chissy wrote: »

I am NOT happy, I have excellent credit. The chap on the phone suggested I check my credit with Experian, which I did straight away. It is rated as 999/999 - the top score.

Either Sainsbury's Energy (from British Gas) has made an error or something underhand is going on?

Or the scores obtained from credit reference agencies are meaningless and are little more than a way of making the credit reference agencies money from anyone willing to pay for a random number

What's on your credit file? Do you have other active credit accounts at the address being supplied that show on your credit file? Are you on the electoral roll at the address being supplied? Does this show on your credit file?

I suspect that some people being asked for deposits have limited to no credit accounts at the address in question and this is why they are being asked for a deposit. Otherwise it makes no sense that I got through with my low meaningless score but lots of active credit accounts on my file at my address but others with the highest possible meaningless score didn't get through

MSE_Dan_L

Hi Levelhead

I'm not sure you've fully understood the points around TCR, sorry if my original explanation wasn't clear enough.

On Cheap Energy Club we show you a personalised TCR rate and also the average TCR rate. The personalised rate shown on your application page is based on your estimated kwh usage (the number of kwh which you've told us that you use on your Cheap Energy Club account), however the TCR rate on the welcome letter from Sainsbury's is I understand based on the national average usage kwh figures (13,500 kwh gas and 3,200 kwh electricity).

TCR is calculated by dividing your annual estimated spend by your kwh usage. As your spend is calculated based on both a standing charge and cost per kwh used, you will find that by changing the kwh figure, the TCR will also change.

TCR was introduced by Ofgem to allow consumers to easily compare tariffs side by side. This is probably a secondary point, but we don't think that TCR is a great measure - as by going via Cheap Energy Club, you're already getting a personalised comparison of different tariffs by cost.

I hope that helps to reassure you. I've added a screenshot below, illustrating (for a different tariff) the two ways in which TCR is shown on Cheap Energy Club.

milltech

This may seem totally stupid but we registered with the Cheap Energy Club and chose the Sainsburys thing by clicking on it, (can't remember exactly), but there didn't seem anything else to do on the page or anywhere else to go, no little message, "That's it we'll be in touch" or whatever. Did I skip a step in the process or will they write? Confused. Advice welcome.

MSE_Dan_L

milltech wrote: »

This may seem totally stupid but we registered with the Cheap Energy Club and chose the Sainsburys thing by clicking on it, (can't remember exactly), but there didn't seem anything else to do on the page or anywhere else to go, no little message, "That's it we'll be in touch" or whatever. Did I skip a step in the process or will they write? Confused. Advice welcome.

It sounds like unfortunately you missed the application page (it should have loaded after you clicked 'switch and get cashback'.

Once you complete our application form, we also show you a 'what happens next page' and send out a confirmation email.

I'm afraid in this case, it sounds like your switch wasn't actually submitted.

weejas

Just to add some balance. I've just switched over and the tariffs for both Elec & Gas are exactly as was shown on the Cheap Energy Club prior to the switch. I'm happy.