Housing Benefit issues

dd101

I know the council can be intrusive but I dont understand why you think its unfair.

If your Mum has more capital sat their then the average family have left over after working two jobs to pay the mortgage or rent, why should someone have their rent paid while they spend over half their £20,000 on things?

She can spend her money on what she wants but NOT if she wants the council to pay her rent. Out of that £20,000 she could probably pay a years rent, buy a car and have the allowed allowance of capital to put away for some security.

I understand that she was desperate for a break and if she spends the money on a break and her HB was reduced or stopped, how would she pay her rent because the money has already been spent BUT this is why if you on full HB and do not/ cannot work you either have to NOT have the break or you spend £2,000 of it on a lovely holiday another £2,000 and still be able to afford to pay the rent for X amount of time until you are entitled to HB again. Otherwise, the council are essentially paying for your Mum to by a car and a luxury holiday??

For example, when I was looking for a flat recently, I had, combined with my partner over the limit of savings entitled to HB. Well, we didn't argue we should be entitled, we used £3,000 of that savings to pay 6 weeks rent and deposit, agent fees, inventory, move in van costs and start-up furniture. Now we have below the amount of capital, so if we wanted to, we could now claim HB (assuming ones earnings were low enough). I would never dream of claiming if I just got £20,000. Sorry but the rules are housing benefits are for those that have NO MEANS to pay their rent and still survive.

seven-day-weekend

Sweetlilac73 wrote: »

she hasnt spent money in order to get benefits. wow.

she was married to an abusive man for 20 years and was on and is still on dla and hb and support related esa and before that was on incapacity benefit because she has almost no vertebrae in her back.

she used money to have a once in a lifetime holiday with her sister because she deserved it.

I cant believe that they have the right to do this..

The fact remains that she had £20k in the bank, which is more than the £16k she is allowed whilst claiming means-tested benefits.

She is supposed to use it to pay her rent, instead of claiming Benefits to do it, until her capital gets to below £16k.

There are certain allowable expenses, which are not classed as deprivation, but I'm sure a 'holiday of a lifetime' will not come into this category.

This is why they are asking her to account for her expenditure.

(And please bear in mind that I did not make the rules).

dd101

Also I forgot to mention, as touched on above that it is not necessarily a bad thing they are asking to see what she spent money on.

The car for example could have been the majority of what shes spent and be considered necessary to improve her life and give her independence etc.

I know the info sounds harsh because she deserves a break and due to her illness but we have to pay our rent if we can afford to pay our rent. It would be lovely to go on holidays when such an amount of money was avialble but you have to remember HB is not a gift or a loan, its money given to you by the government and they are only going to do this when it is absolutely necessary/

Heycock

OP...if you weren't personally involved and were looking at this dispassionately, I think you'd agree that any system that allows someone to have £6,000 in the bank and still get FULL benefits is a very very generous system. And the taper to £16,000 is even more generous.
There was a time, our grandparents will recall, when means testing meant you had to have NOTHING, barely a stick of furniture, before parish/state aid kicked in.

And the state ISN'T telling your mum how to spend her money. There's NO big brother interference....the state, whose only income is what they steal from all of us through taxation without consent, is just saying spend your money how you like as long as you don't expect us to give you more.

seven-day-weekend

Sweetlilac73 wrote: »

I am a taxpayer and personally dont see any issue with a person spending HER money on a holiday and a car so she can maintain her independence.

As for the money she gave me, i am paying every penny of that back , oh and i am also a taxpayer. Never been out of work in my life and yet im paying for layabouts that have never had jobs in their lives and scroungers that have kids when they cant afford them and get thousands of pounds of free money in benefits that they dont deserve, oh yes all out of MY tax money.

Plus you are missing the entire point.

The point was that i dont believe that any government body has the right to tell you how you can spend your money. Its immoral and i imagine illegal and a breach of her human rights.

She deserved that money, she deserved that holiday and i suppose you are all soo moral that if you had a big lot of money come in you wouldnt have a holiday would you.

Oh no, because that you just be too offensive against every tax payer in the country. Idiot !!

That is all fine, as long as she then doesn't expect the State to support her because she has spent all her money on cars and holidays! (Although the car/white goods would probably be seen as acceptable expenditure).

Surely you can see the difference?

Metranil_Vavin

Great wind up thread.

Passed all of 17 minutes of my morning

gayleanne

Sweetlilac73 wrote: »

oh shut up

You are being very rude and obnoxious, you came on this site asking for advice, and you have insulted practically everyone that has advised you. If you know so much and you wont listen, then don't bother posting any more questions. Why should people subsidise you and your mother, whilst you are having holidays, and car repairs, it is called cheating the system, or in other words FRAUD

dd101

No one is trying to offend you, just give advice as you asked on why they want and can ask to see what she has spent her money on.

The rules say that you can only have X amount and claim housing benefit. 6k and I think you can get full benefit if you are entitled to it. As housing benefit is for people that can not afford to pay their rent for whatever reason, if you have 20k, you are considered to be able to pay your rent. If you give 10k to a friend or go on a holiday you are seen as depriving yourself of income, income that the government says you should be coming off housing benefit and instead paying your rent.

As mentioned, due to her disability, the car may not be included but I am not sure of the rules such as the price etc. If she needed a new boiler for example and it cost 2k, I believe this also wouldn't be classed as depriving yourself of income as its a necessity. Improvements on the home to improve her accesibiltiy may also be deemed acceptable but what they wouldn't include is a luxury holiday or giving money away.

The council want a breakdown of what she has spent the money on, so they can work out how much they think was spent acceptably to still get FULL HB and how much was deprivation of income, then they will work out what is left and decide if she owes any money or is still entitled to the full HB. Lets say she spent 5k on things the government rules say acceptable and 5k on things they say are depriving herself of income, that would leave her with 10k but you would need to add back on the 5k classed as deprivation of income and your left with 15k, thats still under the allowed amount but would probably change the amount of HB entitlement.

It is good they have asked her now because they want to make sure she is getting the right amount.

I understand she needed to get away and has been through a lot and she CAN spend her money on what she likes but if someone wants to spend their money on holidays/ new things then they also have to be prepared to start paying their own rent or at least contributing as benefits are not for people that have over 16k savings. If she had the 20k at the start of the claim she would not have been entitled to it until it fell below a certain amount.

I don't know why you still cannot understand or see what is wrong with it. My rent for a year for example is £10500, a holiday 2k, a car, 2k. I could set that all aside and still be left with £5,500 at the end of it, at which point I would be entitled to some HB and soon enough full HB again. I then get my full rent paid and I still have some savings left after that and I can relax knowing that I used my own money to take care of myself for the year, when I was finally in a position to do it. I personally think this is greed, I remember my Mum was made redundant with no pay as such, she had never had to claim but did for a short while, she only had about 2k savings and told the council she would use that to live on until it ran out and then claim, they found it quite funny and said don't be silly that wont last and your entitled to our help! I don't see why someone would even consider to continue claiming with 20k in the bank and I dont mean this to be insulting I just honestly don't see why!

dd101

lighting_up_the_chalice wrote: »

That's a fair comment, Princess. And with that in mind......

People on benefits can spend those benefits in whatever way they see fit. Even with Housing Benefit/LHA, there is no legal compulsion to spend it on rent, that is entirely the choice of the recipient.

However, the rules/regulations under which entitlement is established for means tested benefits is the same for everyone. I would ask the OP if he would be happy for a millionaire to claim benefits if they give their millions to their estranged wife, or children, or friend with a very expensive car repair to deal with?

Hi,

Going off the topic a little bit but I read your comment and found it very interesting and dont understand it haha! This is just a question out of interest but what do you mean by there is no legal compulsion to spend money of rent? I thought if someone claimed HB they must spend it on what they are claiming it for???

Thanks :-)

Dunroamin

dd101 wrote: »

Hi,

Going off the topic a little bit but I read your comment and found it very interesting and dont understand it haha! This is just a question out of interest but what do you mean by there is no legal compulsion to spend money of rent? I thought if someone claimed HB they must spend it on what they are claiming it for???

Thanks :-)

Many people claim LHA/HB and then spend it on something else rather than the rent it's intended for. That's also true for child related benefits and some disability based ones as well. It's a major flaw in the benefits system.