Tony Benn slams BBC on air for "capitulating to Israeli pressure"

Moby

The_White_Horse wrote: »

this is garbage - how is a proper state supposed to protect it's citizens when the enemy firing is fighting guerilla style. bombing from hideouts in schools and hospitals? the response is more than proportionate.

What's a 'proper state'? Is Israel? Should Palestine be a 'proper state'?

The_White_Horse

Moby wrote: »

What's a 'proper state'? Is Israel? Should Palestine be a 'proper state'?

they could have been.

redux

The_White_Horse wrote: »

There will be no peace in the area until the arabs learn to love their children more than they hate the jews:

What a load of insulting drivel.

vivatifosi

CLAPTON wrote: »

better to debate the future and what needs to be done to bring peace

Exactly. A relative of mine was seriously injured in NI. When I heard that the government was negotiating with the IRA I thought they were absolutely bonkers. I was wrong, but couldn't see that because I was too close to it. The families of the dead and injured are always too close.

What's needed in the Middle East now is for people to stop bringing forth the old arguments - about Gaza being under seize and about Israel fighting back against terrorists - which are intractible because they are at the end of the day both right to a certain extent; and to get on with the business of developing peace.

Yes, this is a harder problem to solve in many ways than NI, but even so, it is possible if people can see a common way forward. It's not by chance that Maslow put security close to the bottom of his heirarchy of needs. Security - being safe in one's health and resources, in employment, etc, is a universal need. It doesn't matter who you are or where you are, the need is the same, whether you're in N Ireland, S Africa, or the Middle East.

PaulF81

It will never happen out there in our generation. Its sectarian, and the hatred runs much much deeper than a dispute over land.

Only way to solve the problem is when scientists come up with undeniable proof that God does not exist and the Jews and the Arabs hate each other for no other reason than differing views of the ancient practice of moon worship.

Fortunately, many in the west have been enlightened by the likes of Darwin. Still cant believe the CofE can prevent women bishops and the church can still refuse to marry gay partners in this enlightened age.

Religious nuttery.

The_White_Horse

redux wrote: »

What a load of insulting drivel.

not my words. a quote from Golda Meir.

have you not seen the myriad speeches from Hamas - including from their leader - where they say they love death like the jews love life? madness. how can you negotiate with lunatics that are happy to die. that actively welcome it?????

Conrad

The_White_Horse wrote: »

this is garbage - how is a proper state supposed to protect it's citizens when the enemy firing is fighting guerilla style. bombing from hideouts in schools and hospitals? the response is more than proportionate.

Resistance fighters have always had to hide in the shadows especially when thier enemy out guns and out-techs them by a thousand fold.

I am very right wing btw, but I like to see all sides. As I say I'm not the type to believe our own troops are heros, I prefer stepping back and pondering the big picture whereas a knee jerk thicko right wing response is to assume our boys are heroic.

Same with Israel, it's to simple minded to not see things from both sides. I'd hate to be a Daily Mail type with a closed and slow mind.

We did not bomb Belfast after Brighton, Hyde Park, Manchester or any of the other 59881 IRA attacks. Civilised tough people do not need to employ a massive assymetric power advantage. It is cowardly to so do.

The_White_Horse

Conrad wrote: »

Resistance fighters have always had to hide in the shadows especially when thier enemy out guns and out-techs them by a thousand fold.

I am very right wing btw, but I like to see all sides. As I say I'm not the type to believe our own troops are heros, I prefer stepping back and pondering the big picture whereas a knee jerk thicko right wing response is to assume our boys are heroic.

Same with Israel, it's to simple minded to not see things from both sides. I'd hate to be a Daily Mail type with a closed and slow mind.

We did not bomb Belfast after Brighton, Hyde Park, Manchester or any of the other 59881 IRA attacks. Civilised tough people do not need to employ a massive assymetric power advantage. It is cowardly to so do.

the difference is that Hamas are the elected Govt of Gaza.

ILW

Interesting that White Horse is a big fan of Israel, bearing in mind it was set up as a socialist (lefty) state.

dryhat

PaulF81 wrote: »

Its sectarian, and the hatred runs much much deeper than a dispute over land.

.

This is incorrect. For a start, not all palestinians are muslims.

But throughout history and to this day, the muslim world has generally been very accomodating towards jews. You can go to any middle-eastern country today and find a thriving jewish community which has peacefully existed there for centuries.

The same was true of palestine before it was literally wiped off the map by one group of people to give to another people (who originally considered moving to a plot of land in africa).

This conflict really is about land. But also about justice and morality.

You cannot underestimate how much resentment and hatred this topic stirs up amongst muslim people. And it is one of the main drivers for turning moderate muslims into fanatics looking for revenge.

The sooner this festering boil is lanced the better for all of us.