Tony Benn slams BBC on air for "capitulating to Israeli pressure"

dryhat

The_White_Horse wrote: »

so basically, it's ok for the jews to live under muslim/arab rule - then everyone gets on. but if the muslim/arab has to live under jewish rule - or even just the jews rule themselves, there is a problem. seems fair to me.

The palestinian situation is not about arabs v jews.

Never has been.

There are jews who are anti-zionist.
There are arabs (even palestinians) who are israeli citizens.
There are palestinians who are not muslim.
And many other examples of what appear to be iconsistencies but are aprt of the fabric of the region.

Once you realise that, we can have a sensible discussion.

nicko33

The_White_Horse wrote: »

this is garbage, the arabs hate the jews and always have.

I thought everyone hated the jews, and always have. They even bankrupt Greece. Damn those Orthodontic Jaws.

System

PaulF81 wrote: »

all religion is a pestilence on technological progress of a nation.

Strange then that the arab world was once the leading intellectual driver, at the forefront of mathematics, chemistry and medicine, and arabic a very desirable tool for western thinkers, in the same way that latin was for arabic scholars.

PaulF81

Clifford_Pope wrote: »

Strange then that the arab world was once the leading intellectual driver, at the forefront of mathematics, chemistry and medicine, and arabic a very desirable tool for western thinkers, in the same way that latin was for arabic scholars.

And where are the Arabic nations now in terms of technological progress?or Quaker community? Or evangelical Christian sect? And why?

Religion gets in the way of progress full stop.

A._Badger

Clifford_Pope wrote: »

Strange then that the arab world was once the leading intellectual driver, at the forefront of mathematics, chemistry and medicine, and arabic a very desirable tool for western thinkers, in the same way that latin was for arabic scholars.

Good to see the same old hoary urban myths still alive, thriving and being propagated on the web.

You might want to Google the supposed wonders of Arab/Muslim science and culture before just repeating what the BBC says.

Sapphire

ILW wrote: »

I have to say, that history suggests that European Christians and Catholics appear to have been the real enemies of judaism throughout the centuries. Only since the post war set up of modern Israel have the Arabs really got in on the act.

That is not the case. Several Roman Catholic countries have given shelter to Jews escaping from persecution by other countries over the centuries.

Sapphire

PaulF81 wrote: »

And where are the Arabic nations now in terms of technological progress?or Quaker community? Or evangelical Christian sect? And why?

Religion gets in the way of progress full stop.

In fact, I am not sure whether it is completely due to religion. It may be down to a trait of the character of the people living in that region. From the dawn of the development of human civilization in the Fertile Crescent, the peoples living in the Near and Middle East seem to always have been very warlike. During the three Bronze Ages (from c. 3000 BC) and after it, the various nations and tribes inhabiting this area warred constantly and viciously against each other (despite their many incredible achievements in other areas, such as architecture and great 'art'). You only have to look in detail at the Assyrians and Ancient Egyptians, for example, to see signs of this. Many of us naive, relatively gentle Europeans do not realize this or understand the people inhabiting this region.

PaulF81

I fundamentally believe despite all of the wonderful people I know who are religious, support religions and the wonderful work done in religions name, that at the upper echelons, it is nothing but a method of mind control for the masses.

If sex without contraception didn't cause ballooning child birth rates which feed new recruits to the catholic faith, why was this policy supported? Lets not forget what happens to beautiful innocent children who die prior to christening if you are a believer of that faith.

It's mind control pure and simple. You only have to visit the Vatican or any long term religious establishment (Scientology being the latest ) to realise its about fleecing decent people out of money, or alternatively,to control the masses to support their state.

Despite being a hardline conservative, I have big issues with the religious side of my party, which quite frankly do not belong in this day and age.

I Bet most so called spiritual leaders are atheists, intelligent but completely In acceptance about what their religion represents. Utter control, nothing more, nothing less.

Sapphire

PaulF81 wrote: »

I fundamentally believe despite all of the wonderful people I know who are religious, support religions and the wonderful work done in religions name, that at the upper echelons, it is nothing but a method of mind control for the masses.

If sex without contraception didn't cause ballooning child birth rates which feed new recruits to the catholic faith, why was this policy supported? Lets not forget what happens to beautiful innocent children who die prior to christening if you are a believer of that faith.

It's mind control pure and simple. You only have to visit the Vatican or any long term religious establishment (Scientology being the latest ) to realise its about fleecing decent people out of money, or alternatively,to control the masses to support their state.

Despite being a hardline conservative, I have big issues with the religious side of my party, which quite frankly do not belong in this day and age.

I Bet most so called spiritual leaders are atheists, intelligent but completely In acceptance about what their religion represents. Utter control, nothing more, nothing less.

Much of what you say is true. However, from the dawn of civilization, religions of various sorts helped people to live with things that they could not explain, and which they were very much afraid of. In a difficult world many people need religion as a prop – it is something to believe in and keep families and communities together. Those who suffered terribly during wars found that their faith sustained them and made them able to live with the things they had experienced. (Remember that until recently there was no recognition even for conditions such as PTSD, which many people suffered and still suffer following the Second World War.)

Although the Roman Catholic church (for example) has certainly been responsible for some evil, individuals in it have frequently done a lot of good, served the communities in which they lived in and brought cohesion to them.

(I speak as a non-believer.)

silvasava

Despite what you hear in the news - I work for a major pharmaceutical company & we regularly ship products to Palestine - these go through Israel & we NEVER have a problem with the consignments