The SAP anti competition argument

chanz4

In my job I speak to the suppliers a lot, but going by all of them dont think any are having a goodtime with it

jimjames

undercover_peon wrote: »

Yet this is exactly what is happening in the utility world. EDF have a SAP system and it brought the business to its knees, they have gone from getting decent star ratings to getting the LOWEST star rating. I believe british gas paid around half a billion pounds for a SAP system and are now suing the makers for the damage it has done to thier business.

So why has NPower bought the same kind of system? (for two hundred odd million!!!) This makes no sense in the context of a competitive marketplace where you would want an advantage over your rivals and would seek to benefit from such monumental blunders. Instead we find a company engaged in exactly the same behavior and expecting different results.

Sorry to resurrect an old thread but it seemed more appropriate than starting another new one.

Looks like the SAP NPower billing problems are far from resolved. I've received a letter today that says:

"We are currently experiencing issues billing your npower energy account. We're sorry for the delay and are working hard to resolve this issue"

We've been with nPower since Nov last year and have yet to have an understandable bill. When I logged onto online account last week I had 4 bills, all cancelled and couldn't make head or tail of what they were doing.

After today's letter it appears that nPower can't either! Looks like yet another name to add to the SAP implementation wall of shame. Google WHSmith SAP and you'll find another famous casualty and that was 12 years ago!

http://www.computerweekly.com/news/2240042682/Supplier-sues-consultant-over-failed-WHSmith-SAP-roll-out

joncombe

I have had some experience of SAP software and I can't say it was a good one. The software was slow, bloated and prone to crashing or not working as expected. To be fair SAP were quite good at issuing patches but you quickly lose faith in software if you keep finding problems and have to keep installing patches.

I think a lot of the issues are that high level managers in business get taken in by slick demos and sales pitches and decide this software is better and they want it. So they ditch there existing systems which may be old and not as slick but are usually reliable, lose the experience they will have built up in knowing how the old software works and how to fix it (particularly if it was written in-house) and replace it with something unknown. When the software does not perform as expected or turns out to be unfit for purpose rather than admit a mistake most managers will continue to try and make it work or push the blame onto others.

From a personal point of view if I was running a business I would want all my data to be as open as possible (e.g. in standard SQL databases in a logical schema and not some propriotary format) so that if my system fails to do something I need I can easily write (or employ someone who can) custom processes around the data to do what I need. In the worst case, I can get my data out of the system into something else that works. Even better, if you use open source software than you have the source code to all the programs your business relies on and can either fix problems yourself or add your own customisations or employ/contract someone that can. If you don't have the code and you can't get your data out of the system easily, you are stuck with waiting for the vendor to make the changes you require which is usually time consuming and expensive.

nPower

jimjames wrote: »

Sorry to resurrect an old thread but it seemed more appropriate than starting another new one.

Looks like the SAP NPower billing problems are far from resolved. I've received a letter today that says:

"We are currently experiencing issues billing your npower energy account. We're sorry for the delay and are working hard to resolve this issue"

We've been with nPower since Nov last year and have yet to have an understandable bill. When I logged onto online account last week I had 4 bills, all cancelled and couldn't make head or tail of what they were doing.

After today's letter it appears that nPower can't either! Looks like yet another name to add to the SAP implementation wall of shame. Google WHSmith SAP and you'll find another famous casualty and that was 12 years ago!

http://www.computerweekly.com/news/2240042682/Supplier-sues-consultant-over-failed-WHSmith-SAP-roll-out

Hi jimjames,

I'm sorry to hear about the problems you've been having.

Would you like me to take a look at your account and see what's happening here? If so, just pop me an email (address is on my profile page) with the details on and I'll get onto it.

Many thanks,

Adam

brewerdave

nPower_company_representative wrote: »

Hi jimjames,

I'm sorry to hear about the problems you've been having.

Would you like me to take a look at your account and see what's happening here? If so, just pop me an email (address is on my profile page) with the details on and I'll get onto it.

Many thanks,

Adam

...now there is a VERY brave man :rotfl:

joncombe

jimjames wrote: »

"We are currently experiencing issues billing your npower energy account. We're sorry for the delay and are working hard to resolve this issue"

We've been with nPower since Nov last year and have yet to have an understandable bill. When I logged onto online account last week I had 4 bills, all cancelled and couldn't make head or tail of what they were doing.

You are not alone. Since I got that latter none of my bills from npower have added up or make sense. I am still waiting for a final bill that adds up. You can see the state of my online account below. I raised a complaint but after a few weeks they sent me an identical bill. I complained so they promised to re-calculate it and issue a new one. The response included this.

I agree that the figure of £71.96 isn't showing on this and should be to enable the calculation to add up,

Weeks later I was told that there was no point because the result was still the same and the balance correct. They then tried to argue that having admitted figures were missing from the bill that were needed for the calculation to add up that it was "confusing" but not wrong. To quote.

I have agreed with you that it was confusing, however I have not advised that the bill doesn't add up. To show you that we have billed you correctly, showing all your payments and charges, I am arranging for a statement of account to be issued to you. This will be with you within the next 14 working days.

This was on 19th June but I've never had the promised "statement of account". I had to ring up the person in Executive Complaints and explain why the bill didn't add up. They agreed that it did not add up and promised my account would be re-billed.

I also had this comment.

As your supplies are no longer with npower I am unable to correct the billing of your final account and change the tariff back to non standing charge, therefore, I have worked out the difference in prices and overall it would put £0.40 credit onto the account - you have been on the winter fix tariff until 31 March 2013 even though it does state standard on the bill.

However I did the calculation myself and it was a lot more than 40p. They agreed and sorted out the differnece the standing charge would have added but again, you have to argue the case with npower to get anywhere. As you can see they also admit the wrong tariff is shown on the bill but don't seem bothered by this either. As I have now been waiting more than 8 weeks I've been advised I can take it up with the regulator. I would advise anyone else having these billing issues to raise a complaint with npower and then bring it up with the regulator after 8 weeks have passed.

25.6_Pre-contract_oblig

Hi jimjames,

jimjames wrote:

Sorry to resurrect an old thread but it seemed more appropriate than starting another new one.

IMHO it is entirely appropriate to add to the evidence.

npower have been aware of issues with their 'new SAP system' since at least September 2012.

Some of these have been documented in the very long thread

Warning: npower accept new customers without sending them a Contract
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4273611

I note "Adam at npower" continues to avoid the wider issues.

See from page 4 (Post #61) (of the "Warning: npower ..." thread) where, in November 2012, we have some examples (of npower evading wider issues). In particular Post #64. In Posts #72 to #74 I commented on some of Adam at npower's points (made in Post #65).


Hi joncombe,
your posts are very helpful.

Post #47 (just above), with the illustration (sorry for the pun) of the 'broken system in action' is brilliant. :beer:

Thanks very much for posting it.

Unfortunately, there are many thousands of us who has been badly let down by npower and their broken SAP system.

25.6_Pre-contract_oblig