Cost of child-care makes working pointless for all but the most well paid mothers

ruggedtoast

ILW wrote: »

Don't think many have a problem with children as such, just badly behaved and controlled ones. Similar to dogs really.
If you know your kid will scream and run around, do not take them to a "grown up" restaurant, there are plenty of child friendly places around that those who do not want to be pestered can avoid.

The irony is that on the whole British kids are usually quite well behaved. Try sitting at a table next to some precious little prince from a latin country, or a bawling rage filled Scandinavian pre-schooler being mildly admonished by his parents after hurling a china plate at a waiter's head.

There seem to be a lot of people who can't accept that children are people who have the same right to occupy public spaces and use public transport when they are 2, as they do when they are 42.

ILW

ruggedtoast wrote: »

The irony is that on the whole British kids are usually quite well behaved. Try sitting at a table next to some precious little prince from a latin country, or a bawling rage filled Scandinavian pre-schooler being mildly admonished by his parents after hurling a china plate at a waiter's head.

There seem to be a lot of people who can't accept that children are people who have the same right to occupy public spaces and use public transport when they are 2, as they do when they are 42.

As long as they are capable and willing to abide by the rules that apply to the 42 year old. If not they should be kicked of and left to calm down.

Generali

ILW wrote: »

As long as they are capable and willing to abide by the rules that apply to the 42 year old. If not they should be kicked of and left to calm down.

A 2 year old isn't capable of behaving in the same way as a 42 year old. To expect the same standard of behaviour on the bus is intolerant and foolish.

ILW

Generali wrote: »

A 2 year old isn't capable of behaving in the same way as a 42 year old. To expect the same standard of behaviour on the bus is intolerant and foolish.

Guess I am getting somewhat intolerant.Just seem to be a lot of selfish parents putting young uncontrolled children into situations that affect others in a way that I would never have dreamed of doing when mine were young.

Generali

ILW wrote: »

Guess I am getting somewhat intolerant.Just seem to be a lot of selfish parents putting young uncontrolled children into situations that affect others in a way that I would never have dreamed of doing when mine were young.

There's a difference between expecting a good standard of behaviour and demanding that children are seen and not heard.

For example, the best thing you can do with a child that is having a tantrum is to leave it alone. If you do anything else you are rewarding the behaviour and making it likely to recur.

To many it seems like parents are being lazy or inflicting their child's bad behaviour on others but actually it's the ones that reward the bad behaviour, even by telling the kids off, that are doing nobody any favours.

Now very young children will have tantrums as it's what they do: it's not a case of the child being well or badly behaved but they do not have the emotional maturity to keep their actions in check when overwhelmed with emotion. It's not very pleasant for the rest of us to have to deal with but that's life unfortunately. We've all been tantruming kids and many of us will go on to have kids that will throw tantrums.

suburbanwifey

Generali wrote: »

I love posts like this because they remind me why I left the UK. It's a terrible country to raise kids because there are so many child haters there.

I dislike children also. Could there be a lot of child-haters as you call them due to the fact that there appears to be system in place in the UK whereby children seem to run things? You can't tell them off, they can just run riot everywhere, you complain and You are out of order, not the noisy, badly behaved kids that have no discipline and can even (ludicrously) divorce their parents if they smack them??) Teachers are powerless at the hands of thugs in schools (they get sacked if they react to abuse from kids) etc. etc. Children in this country can do what they like - scratch your car, scream at you, abuse your property and get away with it. Thousands of kids born to inadequate parents who live on benefits who bring kids into this world for an income, not because they want them. They run in the streets at 14 in gangs, who controls them? no one. Nope, I dislike kids and whoever gave kids all these rights should have to live near them! Luckily, I don't.

ILW

Generali wrote: »

There's a difference between expecting a good standard of behaviour and demanding that children are seen and not heard.

For example, the best thing you can do with a child that is having a tantrum is to leave it alone. If you do anything else you are rewarding the behaviour and making it likely to recur.

To many it seems like parents are being lazy or inflicting their child's bad behaviour on others but actually it's the ones that reward the bad behaviour, even by telling the kids off, that are doing nobody any favours.

Now very young children will have tantrums as it's what they do: it's not a case of the child being well or badly behaved but they do not have the emotional maturity to keep their actions in check when overwhelmed with emotion. It's not very pleasant for the rest of us to have to deal with but that's life unfortunately. We've all been tantruming kids and many of us will go on to have kids that will throw tantrums.

Fair enough, but do not take them into a half decent licensed restaurant at 8.30pm where others are paying £60 for a quiet meal.
I truly do not think I should put up with the sight of a two year old puking over the table and the hearing a parent "he has been a little unwell today".

We did leave and refused to pay for the starter we had eaten.

suburbanwifey

The_White_Horse wrote: »

you forgot to add that despite not wanting to look after them and hating them, you will quite happily take your state pension paid for by their taxes, and take the medical care they will give you. One morning, you will wake up, go to the toilet and find it is full of blood. you will panic, and then call the ambulance (driven by other people's kids) to the hospital (staffed by other people's kids) and demand health care (provided and funded by other people's kids).

People like you make me laugh. there should be an opt out box. unless you don't have kids for medical reasons, you should not get to benefit from anyone elses.

childless scum.

Don't you mean a state pension funded by HIS taxes and NIC he paid ALL HIS LIFE! He earned his pension and his right to ride in an ambulance by paying his own contributions all his life. You call him scum? what does that make you?

Generali

suburbanwifey wrote: »

Don't you mean a state pension funded by HIS taxes and NIC he paid ALL HIS LIFE! He earned his pension and his right to ride in an ambulance by paying his own contributions all his life. You call him scum? what does that make you?

Healthcare and pensions are paid out of current not past taxation.

suburbanwifey

Generali wrote: »

Healthcare and pensions are paid out of current not past taxation.

Yes, BUT he has paid TAX and NIC all his life. You not getting that point? just because his contributions paid for someone else whilst he was paying them, doesn't mean he is not entitled to those benefits (health care and pension) when its his turn to get them. He paid. End of. He's entitled. Period.