should colleagues with kids get preference for holidays?

Mad-Frog

BobQ wrote: »

I never said that.

What I did say was that if you work in an industry where taking leave is problematic during school holidays and decide to apply to take it then when you have an alternative (as some seem to advocate) then yes you are selfish.

This is becoming a very sterile debate!

If you think that people booking their holidays when it pleases them to do so a sterile debate then I agree there is no point discussing alternative view points with you

Fire_Fox

BobQ wrote: »

That said if you work in an organisation where these things are decided on the whims of your manager, I think that taking the attitude that those with children should be given no special consideration is selfish. What matters in my view is whether children get to spend time with their parents. Equal opportunity is a fine principle but what about the opportunities of the children?

So we work hard to accrue annual leave and then look forward to spending that with our own families or friends, or at particular events that on particular days or weeks, or on seasonal hobbies and that is selfish? Fair enough then I am selfish!!

Is it selfish to meet my parents in South America to experience a specific part of their world tour (hobby/ passion) with them? Selfish to attend my sibling's wedding, my best friend's wedding, a hen weekend? Selfish to want to spend Christmas with my family and sibling's in laws instead of alone? Selfish to attend (great fun :j) training weekends with friends and maintain my professional registration? Selfish to stay with my seventy something aunt after she had a minor operation? Selfish to help a friend move house and go for a slap up meal and too many drinks after? I see all those as part of a normal healthy single life.

I wish a small minority of people on this thread would stop trying to manipulate and polarise the issue. Few if any people have said parents should get NO special consideration, we have said parents should not get ALL the special consideration, be able to always cherry pick holidays. Again if parents simply want to spend time with their children they should be happy to have their four weeks allocated at random from the fifteen non school weeks.

gemmalouanna

miduck wrote: »

What about those that wish to holiday with a partner/ friend who works in a school?

Agree! We have been through this every year - I am a teacher and when OH tries to get a half term or week in summer holidays so we can have time/go away together he gets so much grief from others saying 'you don't even have kids'.

Every year he says he will work Xmas eve for someone who has kids if they do NY eve but they think they should have it all off.

But then again there are people at his works who are still term time because of their 'kids' who are now 18 years old! People with small kids are asking about the possiblility of going term time and being told there is no availability!

verysillyguy06

Fire_Fox wrote: »

This country is obsessed with our little darlings, try listening to politicians, newsreaders and the rest of the media. It's all about families and pensioners, the word families is frequently used as a synonym for UK citizens. It's not: plenty of us don't fit into that category and we are ignored or treated like second class citizens. You don't need to be militant because the country already revolves around families.

A foreign holiday is not a right, it's a luxury. If it's too expensive scale down your expectations, get a tent or a caravan, a budget chalet in Pontins for a few weekends off season. People managed in the past with many more children than today because relatives and other parents helped out with childcare, what happened to that?

Plenty of single people don't have anyone to go on holiday with, or they need to pay for an expensive single room, nobody to share the bills with so we can't save up for a holiday, nobody to share the cattery or kennel costs with. I don't expect my colleagues to make allowances for any of that, why would I?


!

I have no idea how your response relates to my post? Did I state anywhere about foreign holidays? Which, if you would have any knowledge at all, may know that sometimes are actually cheaper than in the UK?


You just proved my point, that 's all....

BobQ

Fire_Fox wrote: »

So we work hard to accrue annual leave and then look forward to spending that with our own families or friends, or at particular events that on particular days or weeks, or on seasonal hobbies and that is selfish? Fair enough then I am selfish!!

Is it selfish to meet my parents in South America to experience a specific part of their world tour (hobby/ passion) with them? Selfish to attend my sibling's wedding, my best friend's wedding, a hen weekend? Selfish to want to spend Christmas with my family and sibling's in laws instead of alone? Selfish to attend (great fun :j) training weekends with friends and maintain my professional registration? Selfish to stay with my seventy something aunt after she had a minor operation? Selfish to help a friend move house and go for a slap up meal and too many drinks after? I see all those as part of a normal healthy single life.

I wish a small minority of people on this thread would stop trying to manipulate and polarise the issue. Few if any people have said parents should get NO special consideration, we have said parents should not get ALL the special consideration, be able to always cherry pick holidays. Again if parents simply want to spend time with their children they should be happy to have their four weeks allocated at random from the fifteen non school weeks.

I have said all I am going to say on this issue. If people choose to interpret what I say as being directed at every possible reason they chose to take leave then I say if the cap fits wear it!

CupOfChai

BobQ wrote: »

...What matters in my view is whether children get to spend time with their parents...

I don't mean to attack you or your opinions personally by quoting you, but your phrase rather summed up some of my feelings on this, because a person applying to take annual leave, whether or not they have children themselves, is someone's child. IMO neither the parents or the non-parents in the workplace should automatically have priority, because of the whole host of reasons someone might want to have particular dates off.

andygb

As Firefox correctly points out, there are more than enough school holidays available throughout the year, for those people who CHOOSE to have children.
Why should the rest of us be expected to bend over backwards and go without, just because someone makes a lifestyle choice? Why should a "parent" be given "special treatment", with regard to taking leave at short notice and leaving work early, something which certain people see almost as a God given right?

Sambucus_Nigra

poppy_f1 wrote: »

just as an example from a childless person

i have wanted to attend the british GP for the past few years which normally happens early july (school holiday time in scotland) and i have been unable to get the holidays because all the spaces in my work that time has gone by the time the date has been confirmed



the olympics happened during the school holidays this year - the commonwealth games will happen in glasgow during the school holidays


just because its the main holiday time doesnt mean people will take their main holiday (personally i prefer may/june and sept for that) but there are usually some kind of other events on at that time that people may want to attend and have time off work

*Beki* wrote: »

I agree with this- there are a huge amount of music festivals throughout the summer which people would want to book time off for.

Added to the fact that maybe people would like be optimistic and just take their summer holiday when it may (possibly) be summery weather in the UK?!

Now now you two - you know it's only 'hard working happy families' that are allowed to enjoy themselves or get out in the sunshine. Everyone else can go swivel.

Tut tut. Don't do it again.

teaandcupcakesplease

Having children is a lifestyle choice. If you have children then you shoud not get "special treatment" I have not got any children yet and whilst its MY CHOICE to offer the Christmas holidays over to someone who has children, its not expected that i do that. The way i see it, i do it because when my turn comes then maybe my colleagues might do the same for me however i wouldnt expect it or assume they will and thats ok. xx

Del_Astra

Parent here, I don't think being a parent should entitle anyone to time off over another person. Should it not be a rota for working Xmas / Easter / Bank hols? Year about, if you have it off one year then should you not expect to cover the following?

I have read with interest however some posters who appear to be having a bit of a dig where two parents work full time. I find that a bit backward to be honest, and well quite frankly I would rather children see two hard working parents as the norm, than two parents sitting at home and claiming benefits as the norm.

I'm a parent, we both work full time, we have never been abroad as a family and its 7 years since my wife and I went abroad on holiday (pre-kids), we have done the centre parcs, camping & caravan hols in the UK, but not every year. We take annual leave at different times to meet childcare requirements. I have xmas off this year, worked it last year, wife is at work this year, was off last year. We did manage a week together this summer.