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Minimising private care home costs
Comments
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(This is not a reply to greystones. I've no wish to aid and abet his plans, no wish to pay for his care.)
I'd expect the £23.25k limit to be raised. The Dilnot plan won't be implemented in full any time soon, and a simple raising of the threshold is an obvious compromise.
The threshold isn't only for residential care; it's for any social care. And it isn't only for savings, it's for total assets.0 -
(This is not a reply to greystones. I've no wish to aid and abet his plans, no wish to pay for his care.)
I'd expect the £23.25k limit to be raised. The Dilnot plan won't be implemented in full any time soon, and a simple raising of the threshold is an obvious compromise.
The threshold isn't only for residential care; it's for any social care. And it isn't only for savings, it's for total assets.
I don't have any assets except some savings. DH and I own a 2-bed bungalow but even if one of us went into FT residential care the other one would still need somewhere to live.
'Social care' - paying for things we can't do for ourselves. No argument with that.[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Æ[/FONT]r ic wisdom funde, [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]æ[/FONT]r wear[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]ð[/FONT] ic eald.
Before I found wisdom, I became old.0 -
margaretclare wrote: »I don't have any assets except some savings. DH and I own a 2-bed bungalow but even if one of us went into FT residential care the other one would still need somewhere to live.
Ah. I see. I should have realised that. Yes, the bungalow wouldn't be counted.'Social care' - paying for things we can't do for ourselves. No argument with that.
"Social care", yes, is basically that. So when, when I was really pretty ill, Social Services arranged help, I paid. There is a certain unfairness here in that if my doctors had managed to get me into hospital, as one of them wanted to, the "social care" would have been free; having said that, I was probably more at ease at home.
As hospital beds are closed and hospital stays are shortened, and "care in the community" takes over, the issue of what counts as social care may become a vexed one.0 -
greystones wrote: »Hi
We are both approaching 50, have £280k net worth, roughly split 50/50 assets/savings, in reasonable health and DS 14. Savings are currently increasing at around £12k pa.
It is our wish to pass on 99% of what is left to DS and have made wills accordingly. However, the possibility of future care may intervene and substantially reduce what we want DS to inherit.
We are therefore looking for advice/ideas/tips on how to get/keep below the £23k threshold yet still retain an element of control over the above. Obviously this is to avoid care home costs in the future. We appreciate that council homes restrict choice, quality etc and accept our lot should we end up there.
Assuming we're talking several years in the future before this may happen, presumably it's OK to gift DS a substantial amount? If we tranferred a substantial amount to his account (which we have access to), is that counted towards our means when determining eligibility for care costs? Similarly with the house, if we changed ownership several years ahead, would it still be counted?
If you don't agree with this notion that's fine, just after ideas, perhaps from others who have managed to do the above or minimise their liability.
Why on earth would you want to restrict the freedom of choice that being self funding would give you? We'd all like to leave 99% of our assets to our families, but this would then mean making someone elses families pay for our care, via their taxes.
When my widowed Mum was in a nursing home, she paid nearly £2,000 per month for her care, and she died 16 years ago. Although my sod of a brother saw this as "his" inheritance being squandered, I couldn't have been happier with the care Mum received - it was worth every penny, for the quality and peace of mind.
Do you think your son would be happy to have your money, whilst you are still alive, at the expense of you being in a nursing home that isn't the best available for you? You're still young, if you're approaching your 50s, and you may well find the views you hold now will change drastically in the decades to come.
My DH has Alzheimers, and though I was intially floored to learn how much we would pay, as self-funding, for his clubs, and any specialist home care he might need (almost £20 per hour), at least I have control and choice over where he goes, and willingly pay to see him happy, whilst I have a break.
He's physically disabled as well, so long, or even short holidays, aren't on the agenda, so we couldn't spend our savings rapidly, but, should he ever need specialist residential respite care, at least I'll be in the position of being able to choose where he goes. Sometimes I asphixiate myself with the smell of Burning Martyr!!!
xx0 -
I now work in Adult Social Care at my local council. I was told recently (by a senior colleague with years of experience) that in 10 years time there will be very few care homes funded by the council except for people with well progressed dementia. There will be much less private provision as well.
Care homes are just too expensive and the growth in the older population will make the bill unaffordable. Also residential care is not good for people, often they lose their independence and capability very shortly after entering. Much better outcomes for can be obtained by delivering care to them in their own homes.
It is good advice to move to an "age friendly" house/flat while you are still young and fit enough to manage the move with ease and well before any health crisis. Depending on you health, you may not have to make this move for well over 20 years. Having savings will allow you greater choice in who wipes your bum when the time comes.
I'm about your age and when I retire I hope to enjoy my later years by making sure I have a home with can be modified for my needs in a supportive environment and some savings to pay for quality care. You seem to be making sensible plans for the future in putting aside £12k per year. I advise you to stop worrying about how you can arrange to get tax payers to fund your care in later life and start looking forward to enjoying the fruits of your prudence and hard work during your working years.
MrscDebt May '13 £1121
DFD Jan 140 -
I agree with the above.
The OP's post # 1 is really breathtaking in its audacity and assumptions, if you really look at it objectively. They are talking about saving increasing by £12K a year and at the same time, over a period of 20-30 years into the future, they want to keep their savings below £23K! Come on!!
£12K more saved every year, over 10 years that means £120,000, and that's not taking into account gain depending on where it is saved/invested. Another 10 years it becomes a quarter of a million near as dammit. And they want to keep it below £23K in total? Can't be done. Either that or it is completely pointless saving at all.
I'm saving because we don't know what our needs may be in time to come, but I can't save at that rate. I'd quite like to become a millionaire purely by saving, but it ain't going to happen. I haven't got the time these people have left! But if I had, there are countless good causes out there that would appreciate a little money. Getting rid of money isn't hard - see 'The Secret Millionaire' TV programmes.It is good advice to move to an "age friendly" house/flat while you are still young and fit enough to manage the move with ease and well before any health crisis. Depending on you health, you may not have to make this move for well over 20 years. Having savings will allow you greater choice in who wipes your bum when the time comes.
Well said. This is why DH and I are saving. Choice. If we want our bathroom turned into a wet-room we know people who can do it for us, not wait 18 months for the council to help.
My first husband and I moved to this 2-bed bungalow in 1990 when we were in our late 50s. It was one of the best things we ever did, even though he didn't live very long to enjoy it. I couldn't imagine me living alone in a 3-storey stone cottage in the Pennines, not now.[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Æ[/FONT]r ic wisdom funde, [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]æ[/FONT]r wear[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]ð[/FONT] ic eald.
Before I found wisdom, I became old.0 -
margaretclare wrote: »This is really excellent advice, especially the idea of moving into more 'manageable' housing. My first husband and I moved into a 2-bedroom bungalow and on the whole it was the best thing we ever did, even though he didn't live very long to enjoy it. I was left with a mortgage which eventually got paid off by equity release, so - make sure you get the mortgage paid off before any disasters happen.
Approaching 50 - you've got a whole lotta living to do yet, far too soon to be looking forward to moving into a care home.
Saving nearly £12K a year? I should be so lucky! I've saved more in retirement years than I ever did before that, but my savings haven't yet reached those kind of levels.
Now, some of the clever people who inhabit these boards can maybe explain some of these 'cut-off' figures for me, and what they portend. We are not on any means-tested benefits and we like it that way.
The 'cut-off points' I've heard mentioned are: £10K - for means-tested benefits (this was discussed at great length recently)
£23K - is that for paying for long-term residential care? I haven't got £23K yet, but depending how the FTSE does etc, given time who knows.
I've also heard the figure £6K mentioned. DH and I are way, way beyond that.
Have I got all this right?
Another point: you say 'neither of us wants to burden the other with costs of long-term care' - but it is charged to the individual receiving the care, isn't it, so no question of 'burdening' your spouse?
The £23k includes the value of your home. However, if only one of you goes into care, it won't be counted (as you are both over 60).(AKA HRH_MUngo)
Member #10 of £2 savers club
Imagine someone holding forth on biology whose only knowledge of the subject is the Book of British Birds, and you have a rough idea of what it feels like to read Richard Dawkins on theology: Terry Eagleton0 -
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seven-day-weekend wrote: »The £23k includes the value of your home. However, if only one of you goes into care, it won't be counted (as you are both over 60).
If a spouse remains in the house, it doesn't matter what age the couple are. The value of the house would be disregarded.0 -
Sign a great lump over to your son! :cool:
He'll have a whale of time - iphones and sports cars, not to mention boozing and holidays.Member #14 of SKI-ers club
Words, words, they're all we have to go by!.
(Pity they are mangled by this autocorrect!)0
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