Help wrongly accused of using mobile phone whilst driving

chuckles1066

tillson wrote: »

I am going to leave it here. There seems to be quite a lot of unsubstantiated general accusations regarding the integrity of the police going on here. Perhaps the fact that no one can evidence their remarks says it all.

I think the plain fact is that people can't accept being told that they are doing something wrong. And when confronted with the fact rely on the rather tired excuse of the police making it all up.

The problem is, in amongst all the unsubstantiated claims regarding the integrity of the Police, there are also claims that CAN be substantiated.

This isn't a "bash the Police" post either, for what it's worth I agree with your last sentiment. You only have to scour the internet and you'll find thousands of posts along the lines of "I was caught speeding today, how can I get off?"

However, and this is the sad thing, the police, through their own actions over the years, have brought on a general feeling of mistrust.

SenorGroucho

I think anyone caught in the future in similar circumstances might well want to take notes at the time, give the officer the chance to inspect the phone, give the officer the number of the phone and the network, give the officer the chance to search for other mobiles on your person or in the car. If the officer appears like he will continue with the allegation, you should note the officers badge number and inform him that you will contest it in court and that your network records for the number supplied will prove your phone was not in use at the time given. It is quite important to take notes at the time or just after the incident as you will be able to refer to the notes in court.

DonnyDave

I give my advice as someone who knows little about the legal system.

The police officer needs to be asked how long he saw you (allegedly) using your mobile phone. Was it a split second? Or several seconds?

If you showed him your phone, did he not find it strange that it was a silver one, and that he (apparently) saw you on a black one? If so, why did he not ask you if you had another phone and to produce that phone?

Why did he take no interest in your attempt to proove your innocence? (I'm a little unsure about this one because it is obviously possible for the call record to be deleted straight away).

I have always assumed that under these sorts of circumstances that, whilst legally you don't have to, you really need a solicitor, unless you are legally qualified yourself.

As you don't have a solicitor, who is giving you legal advice?

susy_2

I was under the impression that the police officer would have to attend court?? And if he didn't, the case would be awarded to you on a technicality??

Perhaps not ....

redux

tillson wrote: »

I am going to leave it here. There seems to be quite a lot of unsubstantiated general accusations regarding the integrity of the police going on here. Perhaps the fact that no one can evidence their remarks says it all.

I think the plain fact is that people can't accept being told that they are doing something wrong. And when confronted with the fact rely on the rather tired excuse of the police making it all up.

Sorry to be rude, don't be so obnoxiously patronising.

What evidence do I owe you to substantiate what I said?

I don't have any obligation whatsoever to give you details of my identity in order for you to check the actual details of this, a case heard and convicted with no evidence.

My solicitor suggested I write to the Lord Chancellor about how ludicrously dealt with it all was, where neither two magistrates nor a county court judge appeared to have much idea of actual law pertaining to such cases.

the_tired_one

I often scratch or play with my ear when driving - its just occured to me that it may look like I a mobile phone to my ear!

tillson

Sorry to be rude, don't be so obnoxiously patronising.

That's Ok, you are entitled to voice your opinion.

What evidence do I owe you to substantiate what I said?

You don't owe me anything at all. However, in polite circles it is usual to accompany ones comments regarding the charachter or integrity of an individual or group of individuals with some form of reasoning. By reasoning, I do not mean anecdotal stories told over a can of Special Brew and a Bensons. Rather some form of incident that is traceable to a source independent of the one making the statement. Without this, the comment has little value.

I don't have any obligation whatsoever to give you details of my identity in order for you to check the actual details of this, a case heard and convicted with no evidence.

Believe me, I really do not want any clue whatsoever as to your identity. I take it that the case is the one where you make the comment, "It is even possible to be convicted if the bloke skives off sick to avoid explaining in court."

By bloke, do you mean a Police Officer?

How do you know he was skiveing. Have you examined his medical record or had access to it and confirmed that on the day in question he was not suffering from any medical condition that prevented him from being in court?

This is exactly the kind of situation that you are complaining about. In your mind, you have effectively tried and convicted this person of faking illness in order to secure a conviction against you without any evidence to support your claim.

Perhaps you were just having one of those Special Brew and Bensons moments when you wrote it.

matthewmps

Hi all, hope madmax2 doesn't mind me jumping onto this post but exactly the same thing has happened to me today.
I was at some lights at an M62 junction in Manchester with my right elbow on my passenger door ledge & my hand on the side of my head,I looked to my right & there was a police range rover parked in a police layby by the roundabout.As i set off from the lights the police vehicle followed me & pulled me over some 200 meters down the road.
I didnt have a clue what reason I dad been stopped for so I got out of my vehicle & so did he.Then he asked me to grab my mobile phone & it dawned on me immediatley what he was getting at.So I get in his vehicle with my mobile phone & he says that I was using my mobile phone at the traffic lights & dropped it when I saw him.I said that I wasn't using it but he wouldn't have none of it.I then asked him to check my mobiles call register to prove it but he refused to look at it saying that he is that certain I was using it that he didn't need to.I pleaded with him to look at it but he wouldnt see any reason.I then asked him to look at his cameras in his vehicle, and he said that he only has one for number plate recognition.(I didn't believe this as it was a motorway traffic range rover and i'm sure they have others for speeding etc). He then told me to use a handsfree kit in future,I replied that the phone has a built in one that I always use while it & while it is in its holder.He then wrote the £60 3 penalty points ticket out and asked me to sign it which I refused so he noted it on the ticket,I also told him that I would take it to court.I then left his vehicle with the ticket.
None of us had passengers it there vehicles so there are no witnesses there.
I have rung up Vodafone to ask for call records of incoming/outgoing calls & they said that only the police can request incoming call data.
Where can I go from here??? Any suggestions anyone,at the moment I want to take it to court as a matter of priciple,but am I just wasteing my money?
does the officer need evidence or is it just my word against his(we all know who will win that one).I don't own another mobile phone & have a clean licence & about 10 years no claim bonus.

redux

tillson wrote: »

[This is exactly the kind of situation that you are complaining about. In your mind, you have effectively tried and convicted this person of faking illness in order to secure a conviction against you without any evidence to support your claim.

Perhaps you were just having one of those Special Brew and Bensons moments when you wrote it.

I have no idea why you are so persistent in this trolling abuse of other members, nor do I care, so please do not subject any of us to your virulently patronising lecture about politeness.

The prosecution had 3 opportunities to get this man to come to court, and failed.

I actually wanted him to arrive, to explain whether he observed that the recording on the camera was faulty or not in line with the accusation he had made, why he assumed that the car I was driving was 80% more powerful than it really was, and why he assumed that a nearly one tonne trailer was "quite light".

At the first hearing, outside the courtroom, the prosecution solicitor was overheard being scathing about the case against me, as she owned a similar car and said it was not that powerful.

I do not know why supposedly professional police officers try to embellish cases by making up extra details that risk damaging the case by being repudiated, but it does happen, irrespective of your wishes to insult and accuse of lying anybody that dares to suggest it.

As for the OP, I must apologise for being off-topic, but I must advise that your chances are not good. There are too many people around who assume that an accusation is itself proof of guilt, and might perhaps have people wrongfully convicted left in prison in order to protect the reputations of the incompetent failures whose investigations failed to find the real culprits.

oldbill1969

madmax2 wrote: »

Thanks again for all your replies and advice.

An intersting note is the incident occured in Oct 2006 and the police officer's statement is dated 20.2.07 (4 months later) which maybe explains the fact why there are some inaccuracies i.e. the phone being black when it is in fact silver, the fact that he claims my partner had the phone in his left hand in his left ear (my partner was actually itching his RIGHT ear) - perhaps the details were not that fresh for him after 4 months!

Not wanting to put a damper on this but it is not unusual in these cases that the statement is written so long after, as you were issued with a Fixed Penalty Notice. A statement would only have been requested when it was clear the matter was progressing to Court. What I would say is that the officer would have been expected to have made a detailed entry in his Pocket notebook as soon as practicable after the incident. The detailed entry would then have assisted in completing the statement whenever it was required