Do I have to give balls back?

adamg02

On the original question, if you find a ball in your garden and you have no reasonable reason to know who the owner is & have made reasonable steps to discover (ie looked for a name and address on the ball), then I don’t see why you couldn’t throw it where you want. - only works if you find ball later, and not when its lobbed over with the associated cry of ownership.



If someone chucked an empty beer can or plank of wood in your garden, that would go in the bin or over the fence wouldn’t it? So I think it would be reasonable to throw it back in to public area, otherwise you risk damage/injure your neighbour if you threw back into their garden. I think also perhaps a fair bit of ignorance, playing dumb would go well… eg “what ball?.. I don’t see a ball, but I did see a dog out there playing with something.. “.


Also, does anyone know the rules to who gets the ‘ugly side of the fence’? when you have a wooden one with the posts & beams that run sideways, is there a legal point to who gets the nice side or ugly side? - as OP, if this is not a clearly defined point in law.. I would make sure any new fence is ugly their side.

mrs_sparrow

MrsE wrote: »

I could do chicken wire & privit hedges, that would keep the dogs out. But I don't think it would be any cheaper than replacing the 8 panels that need replacing. Plus it would be a lot more work for me, with trimming. As I've said I have nearly 150 foot to look after on my other boundary AND front hedges too, I don't really want more hedges.The garden has a load of panels another 10 at least - but they are not in the "foorball" area, they are behind their huge long shed & big fish pond & by their patio, so they haven't been battered.I should have taken photos, I should have nipped it in the bud as soon as it started.My ex husband before he moved out told the man next door he would/was going to replace the fence (for a quite life) hence they went all out to destroy what they could.Husband left & I was left with nearly 50 foot of broken fence. Man next door complained to the council to get them to write to me that fence was dangerous to his kids as it was splintered & had nails & screws sticking out & I needed to replace it. The council actually wrote to me telling me to replace it! I rang them & they agreed that I didn't HAVE to replace it, but I had to remove any thing that could be a danger to his children (Maybe they should stay within their garden.........) Anyway so I removed the broken & battered panels.Now my grandson is toddling & my DD doesn't have a garden, I want him to be able to run around it, without trying to keep him within my boundaries, or getting hit by balls, or stepping in dog poo!

We have 130ft Mrs E - we have an extra 20ft that we fenced off away from the shed so the dogs cannot get over that bit so I do know what it is like to have a long garden. If you already have shrubbery it'll not be an issue, the chicken wire will also maintain the shrubbery into your side of the garden and stop growth backwards because the holes are too small for the shrubs to grow through.

It honestly is not going to cost you more than fence panels - you have said you have been quoted £400 - and personally, if they are going to trash them it would be a waste or money anyway - do that when the boy is older.

We paid £50 for the 4ft high stock fencing, posts were around £5 each - I have 12, and we bought some wire as we was replacing a smaller fence so needed posts too. I paid a guy £100 to put the posts in as hubby was ill at that time - otherwise he would have done it - however you have the posts already.

A privet hedge has wide leaves, they will not grow though the holes of the chicken wire and it looks neat and tidy, the way it grows means that you can go out once every 3-4 months and just lop a few bits off - even I can maintain ours and I HATE gardening with an absolute passion.

If the house is a council house and the boy is climbing over, complain - complain, complain, complain and keep a diary. Do that anyway and then go to the police and have them for anti-social behaviour. BUt remember if you are privately owned you'll have to declare any neighbour disputes.

Pro and cons to chicken wire:

Pros: It will be:
very cheap
you can do it yourself using the posts that you have (ask your DD to help you)
stop the boy from climbing over
stop the shrubs growing through to his side
is no good for rebounding a football
will keep the dog out
you can keep an eye on the boy
The boy can see your GS or you in the garden and might not kick the ball over so often or damage your things.
You can throw the ball back and can see where it is going *ahem*

Cons:
It looks crap
I can't actually think of anything else.

Wooden fence:
Cons:
It is very expensive
You need to get someone in to do it
That can take months - summer will be over
The kid will break it again
You cannot see what they are doing
Shrubs will still need to be trimmed

Pros:
It is tidy
It will keep the dog out
Can't think of anything else

I know that you think it will be harder to maintain and expensive but it won't be - don't worry about the privet, just keep the dog out. It'll be a quick fix for now, until the kid gets bored of playing footie.

The balls - well, you'll never stop those, where we used to live the kids next door would come over the fence and play on our kids play equipment and there was nothing whatsoever we could do about it. And I'll not even start on the balls, toys, broken glass, etc.... The house was rented and not ours so we could not get into any neighbour disputes either. What you CAN do is get a quick fix up so your GS can make the most of this weather and have a rethink/save for the winter months.

I know it is not the answer you are looking for but the parent has already proved he will complain about everything and anything (the fence for a start) so if you start getting rid of his footballs - which can cost anything up to £15/£20 each - then he IS going to start reporting you and YOU will be the one that gets done for theft as you know that the balls belong to him. And you really want to try and avoid him finding a reason to get you in trouble. Sorry, but quick fix would be the way forward for me - cheaper, easier, etc....

mrs_sparrow

Another alternative.

You could send the neighbour a letter stating that you are getting the fence fixed on xx date and you will be getting CCTV installed to video the fenced area of the back garden. (NOTE: You can not video the boy but you can video your garden) Point out that should the fence be broken by footballs you will have no alternative but go through the small claims court to recover the cost of the fence because you cannot afford to keep on replacing it.

Also tell them in the letter you will get periodic photographic evidence of state of the panels to prove any damage is being done from their side of the fence and not yours.

Send the letter by Recorded or Special Delivery so you have proof they have received the letter. Check it has arrived.

And then sue them in the county court if they damage the fence again. They have been warned.

Show the letter to the other neighbour and suggests he does the same.

However, remember any neighbour disputes have to be declared if the house is ever sold so give this action real thought.

valk_scot

Well if you're going to write a letter, make it a solicitors letter. Make sure it included the phrases "have replaced fence at your request as a gesture of goodwill" and "Will hold you liable for any future damage".

Also start keeping an accurate diary of every incident, including copies of letters, notes of any conversations, a log of every time the ball comes over, photos of the current state of the garden & the new fence etc etc.

And I'm quite serious about only returning the balls to a parent. It will expose you to some unpleasant conversations I expect but hey, if they use threatening language then you've got instant grounds for involving the police, no? I don't think you've been unreasonable so far, it's just that the situation has changed for you. Oh, make sure they know that this is so, include it in the letter along with your concerns about your grandson being hit by a heavy leather football.

As to the dog poo they're not liable for that, your far neighbour is unfortunately so don't drag that into any formal complaint, it's a red herring really. If you get a satisfactory boundary fence set up then that particular problem will cease to be a problem anyway. However it might be worth having a word with dog owning neighbour anyway, they might be interested in a two pronged assault and if there has to be a complaint to the council then it would be good to have it from both sides. Dog neighbour would probably find that a cheaper type of barrier would suffice though, like plastic safety barrier.

Final thought...you don't have a local Community Policeman, do you? This sort of thing is exactly what they deal with so it would be well worth going in for some sort of advice. I had a problem in my last house with the local teenage oiks doing ninja somersaults through my privet hedge onto my flower beds so I had a word with the CP Officer. He advised me on the legalities of it and also went round to speak to the parents of the three lads involved. Knowing they'd had their cards marked was enough to solve the problem.

~Chameleon~

mrs_sparrow wrote: »

The balls - well, you'll never stop those, where we used to live the kids next door would come over the fence and play on our kids play equipment and there was nothing whatsoever we could do about it. And I'll not even start on the balls, toys, broken glass, etc....

Highlighted text - now this is something I completely fail to understand and it's not the first comment of it's kind in this thread. If someone was coming into my garden uninvited they'd jolly well be told to leave pronto!!

How can you not control what goes on in your own garden? I can't think of any children I know that would enter someone else's property without permission and use their play equipment even if they are friends of the family.

Mojisola

adamg02 wrote: »

Also, does anyone know the rules to who gets the ‘ugly side of the fence’? when you have a wooden one with the posts & beams that run sideways, is there a legal point to who gets the nice side or ugly side? - as OP, if this is not a clearly defined point in law.. I would make sure any new fence is ugly their side.

There are no rules or laws. Whoever pays for the fence decides which way round to place it.

Traditionally, it used to be that the posts were in the owner's garden and the slats facing the neighbours because then the fence fully encloses the garden. If you place it the other way round, the bits between the posts are your land but you can't maintain them. It also stops the neighbour having a handy rail to put their foot on if they want to nip over into your garden.

adamg02

Thanks Moji, in that case...

OP when/if it comes to doing the fencing, I would be inclinded to go for something like this (picture found on google images search for "garden fencing" from maingardencare co uk - no idea who they are), looks suitably normal, tough and yet ugly enough on their side, with a climbing thorny rose type thing trailing across the top to discourage jumpers.

Also the sticky out bits will make for more annoying bounces if the kid plays football against it.

Mojisola

I'd go for the chicken wire and some plants - even if they're climbing plants in pots that can be moved later on - until the lad grows out of kicking balls at the fence.

If Dad doesn't like the look of the wire netting, he can put up his own fence. Do you think son will then be allowed to kick balls at it?

krlyr

Have you looked into second-hand panels? I got about 6-8 5' panels with 1' trellis toppers from Ebay for about £30 - and he had a mate with a flatbed who delivered from for us. He'd already had new panels put up and was going to bin the old stuff but his wife wanted him to get a bit of cash for them. She was happy for some money, he was happy to get rid, I was happy to get a bargain - they were in great condition, he'd only replaced them for taller panels.

mrs_sparrow

~Chameleon~ wrote: »

Highlighted text - now this is something I completely fail to understand and it's not the first comment of it's kind in this thread. If someone was coming into my garden uninvited they'd jolly well be told to leave pronto!!

How can you not control what goes on in your own garden? I can't think of any children I know that would enter someone else's property without permission and use their play equipment even if they are friends of the family.

Because they were selfish, ignorant bar-stewards. They'd come home and have their music from 1am til 5am even tho I was 7 months pregnant and also had a baby and hubby bad to be up for work. Bedside alarms that would go off constantly, loud, for an hour each morning (we did take great delight in setting our on loud for 3.30am and going away for the weekend, LOL). Amongst other stuff they were the family from hell. Their dog also used to come into our garden so we fenced the hole their kids had made up.

I told them often not to come in all the time but apparently I could not put anything on top of the fence that might damage themselves or their clothing if they climbed over. I thought if anti-vandal pain and those cat spikes but I was told if the kids hurt themselves I would be liable. They would sit on top of our shed while we was in the house - one day I went to the bedroom and made out I was recording them with the camera - that soon moved them.

The mother would leave a 5 and 7 year old on their own, I called the police but nothing was ever done. Ridiculous. And they were in a council house.

There was nothing we could do about it other than make sure that if there was anything that could be nicked it did not get left out.