Preparedness for when

Goldiegirl

Blue_Doggy wrote: »

What we need is an import of a very large quantity of Stiff-Upper-Lips for all the poor youngsters and other whingers (including those who, like the man I was talking to yesterday, voted out and is exceedingly miffed that actual exit did not take place on Monday at the latest - gosh, he went on about it!).

Perhaps there are some available from a dusty store-room in the old Commonwealth that they could send us ...

The gentleman you were talking to highlights that some people truly don't understand the magnitude of the events that have been put in train by their vote.

Like Vjsmum, I'm very worried about the future

We now need to find someone who'll take the irrevocable step. of invoking article 50, and leading the negotiations though the labyrinthine maze of the Eu

But, the Eu don't want us to leave and will make this incredibly difficult for us. They will not be willing to make concessions - we are not going to be able to sail through and 'tell' them what we want - we'll be the one who is cap in hand. Then, any treaty will have to be ratified by all 27 countries, all with their own agenda. All of this within 2 years. If a deal is not struck and they refuse to extend the 2 years, then no treaty - which will make trade with the Eu very expensive

If we do get any treaty, no doubt we'll still need to accept free movement of people - so not much change to immigration.

No doubt we'll have to pay the Eu for the privilege of trading with them, so we'll still be paying large sums of money to the Eu - but as we're no longer a member will get none back.

There's all the uncertainty about how this will affect us, and due to all this, international companies may leave - creating job loses and affecting economic growth.

It's a very uncertain toad ahead and the ironic thing is, we are making a concious decision to bring all this uncertainty down on to our heads.

I don't understand why people aren't more worried.

I can't see how any of this 'takes back control' as we will still have to deal with the Eu if we want to trade with them - but we'll be on the outside, like beggars looking in at the feast.

I feel it is realistic to be very concerned about the short and medium term future.

I see a lot of comment about past difficult times and comment about the young needing to get a backbone.

But, apart from a few, I still don't see much comment about why people aren't deeply concerned about the current situation - a situation which basically changes the future for ever. It really is that big.

monnagran

mardatha wrote: »

Some brilliant posts yesterday, we have a lot more commonsense than anybody in Westminster.
I look on myself as a 100% Scottish and nothing else, not European and not British either.
I didnt vote because the RV wasn't well that day and the village hall/polling station is 2 miles away - but I would have voted out. I don't like the way the EU is going and I don't like how the Germans are taking over, and they have history in that department don't they.. quite a lot of it!
Young people now have it easier than they ever did before and it doesn't seem to have done them a lot of good..

Thank you Mar. This is something that I have secretly felt for years but didn't have the gall to come out and say it.

Here goes.

In the last 100 years Germany has twice tried to snatch power over Europe by force and failed each time. After the last war and having licked its wounds and recovered, it cast about for a different way of achieving the same objective. And has almost achieved it.
Trust the Brits to throw a spanner in the works yet again.
I keep waiting and hoping to be proved wrong.

Still waiting...................

Retiring to dodge the brickbats.

x

pineapple

Tbh the negotiators on the EU side are also going to be walking a tightrope.
Concede too much and it could encourage other countries to try and break free. Go in too hard and it could panic them with the same result.

mrs-moneypenny

Surely the future post brexit is no more scary and uncertain leaving the EU than it would have been remaining. It is looking increasingly like if not being directly lied to the truth was being withheld about the plans for turkeys acceleration into the EU group and the plans to have an open border throughout the planned EU superstate with all rules and regs coming from Brussels along with a merged euro army rather than individual countries having their own defence. If the talk of a planned national insurance number coming from the EU is true how long would it be before Brussels decided when we can retire and what our pensions are to be. Pensioners in Greece aren't fairing very well at the moment and having that as my future would scare me!
No one on either side of the decision can know what the future holds or would have held all we can do is hope for the best plan for the further and work darn hard to make it the best it can possibly be for all of us.
The first thing we need is a good strong leader to negotiate the best deal possible until we get that we will be in a state of limbo which will only cause more panic and unrest.

If as a result of us leaving other countries do start looking for the exit they obviously weren't happy either that's not our fault, it may result in the EU becoming a smaller more manageable and less corrupt entity that will have less chance of bullying or strong arming the nations who do want to leave. It has been widely reported that we import more from the EU than we export back if that is the case they are not going to want to lose our business so will still trade with us, and if they put tariffs on our imports surely we can put them on our exports. Other countries of the world outside the EU a ale ey lining up expressing a desire to trade with us direct it isn't the end of the world.

pineapple

Goldiegirl wrote: »

It's a very uncertain toad ahead and the ironic thing is, we are making a concious decision to bring all this uncertainty down on to our heads.

I don't understand why people aren't more worried.

I can't see how any of this 'takes back control' as we will still have to deal with the Eu if we want to trade with them - but we'll be on the outside, like beggars looking in at the feast.

I feel it is realistic to be very concerned about the short and medium term future.

I do have concerns, But personally I choose to take the longer term and glass half full view. I think the road ahead if we stuck to the EU was also uncertain - and complicated by our being in a binding agreement in a volatile situation - with a debt crisis simmering just below the surface. Having to deal with the EU is not the same as being legislated by them and I would rather be on the outside tbh - I don't think we will be looking in at any feast.

Mojisola

[QUOTE=monnagran;70918114
In the last 100 years Germany has twice tried to snatch power over Europe by force and failed each time. After the last war and having licked its wounds and recovered, it cast about for a different way of achieving the same objective. And has almost achieved it.
Trust the Brits to throw a spanner in the works yet again.
I keep waiting and hoping to be proved wrong.

Still waiting...................

Retiring to dodge the brickbats. [/QUOTE]

We haven't 'thrown a spanner in the works'. By pulling out of Europe, we've handed power over to Germany.

While we were part of the club, we were a balancing factor.

Blue_Doggy

mardatha wrote: »

Some brilliant posts yesterday, we have a lot more commonsense than anybody in Westminster.
I look on myself as a 100% Scottish and nothing else, not European and not British either.
I didnt vote because the RV wasn't well that day and the village hall/polling station is 2 miles away - but I would have voted out. I don't like the way the EU is going and I don't like how the Germans are taking over, and they have history in that department don't they.. quite a lot of it!
Young people now have it easier than they ever did before and it doesn't seem to have done them a lot of good..

I agree about the level of debate here - very good.

Isn't it a pity that the UK hasn't been more wholehearted about being in the EEC/EU over the last 40 years? We're just as good as Germany, and our voice (had we wished to use it constructively) had just as much weight as that of the Germans. Instead of grandstanding and throwing our handbags around we could have been part of shaping Europe for the second half of the 20th century and into the 21st. Instead of which we whined and moaned and put everyone's backs up. We wasted our opportunity.

I don't think there's any point in picking apart the statements of various European bods at present, everyone (possibly including the UK) is just starting to articulate pre-negotiation positions which are the basis for the actual negotiations.

Why does everyone keep raising the World Wars? Does anyone think we lost? I was under impression we won them both.

VJsmum

Blue_Doggy wrote: »

I agree about the level of debate here - very good.

Isn't it a pity that the UK hasn't been more wholehearted about being in the EEC/EU over the last 40 years? We're just as good as Germany, and our voice (had we wished to use it constructively) had just as much weight as that of the Germans. Instead of grandstanding and throwing our handbags around we could have been part of shaping Europe for the second half of the 20th century and into the 21st. Instead of which we whined and moaned and put everyone's backs up. We wasted our opportunity.

I don't think there's any point in picking apart the statements of various European bods at present, everyone (possibly including the UK) is just starting to articulate pre-negotiation positions which are the basis for the actual negotiations.

Why does everyone keep raising the World Wars? Does anyone think we lost? I was under impression we won them both.

Agreed - also not sure why someone's (including mine) poor childhoods are relevant, really. i don't want my children to go through what i did, I have worked all my life to try to ensure that didn't happen. We have put measures in place to try to hedge against them having that struggle. That doesn't mean i don't expect them to work for a living, or have a backbone. I am not hard up (at the moment) but certainly not the privileged elite.

Ahh, what's the point? Both sides still seem as entrenched as ever....

[Deleted User]

I thought we had freedom to speak??? perhaps I'm wrong, I thought we could contribute to a debate, maybe not!

I'm sorry if my contribution is not acceptable and irrelevant to the current discontent, I'll remove me and my 'unacceptable' thoughts and posts for a while, good luck!

pineapple

Moving forward, I see Boris Johnson has stepped aside. Theresa May would probably get my vote (if I had one) though Andrea Leadsom will be one to watch.