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Preparedness for when

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  • ZTD
    ZTD Posts: 24,327 Forumite
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    :) Morning all.

    Interesting stuff going on with the sudden increase in bank deposit cover in event of a crisis

    The cynic in me thinks someone pointed out to Ministers that there was a window of vulnerability for their money if a bank should go under while they were flipping their second homes using their MPs' expenses.

    Easy to fix (with tax payers money), so they did.
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    and TBTF banking-collapse trials. When I read about the first one last week, I thought to myself, here it comes. When I read about the second today, I'm convinced the beggars are up to something.

    How much taken-over banks pay the Government back was dependent upon LIBOR. By fiddling it, banks cost the Government money.

    Try to avoid doing that - you can go to jail for that. Ripping off ordinary people is a fair game however.
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    I also fear Ebola is already incubating in the UK. To me, bearing in mind how many people come in and out of this country, or transit it as a major airline hub, it beggars belief that we won't get it here before much longer.

    We're not as important as we like to think. If you're worried about that, watch Amsterdam Schiphol as well. The probabilities are, it will get hit first.
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    Basic principles of law are being overturned in many parts of the so-called democratic west.

    Yes, I'm curious about that. Historical cycles now seem to out-of-phase with economic cycles. The resolution of that could be unpleasant.
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    Grubbyments don't like cash, they don't like portable valuables like gems, jewellery and precious metals, they don't like the rest of us to have things which can be moved about under the radar. It's about controlling everybody, not just about fighting crime.

    Trouble is, when TSHTF, it's those portable valuables which have enabled people to flee and make fresh starts.

    Which is *why* they don't like them.
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    Ach well, if they're agin' it, all the more reason to do it, I reckon.

    The side-effect of stopping people fleeing, is that they will stand and fight. Be careful what you wish for and all that.
    "Follow the money!" - Deepthroat (AKA William Mark Felt Sr - Associate Director of the FBI)
    "We were born and raised in a summer haze." Adele 'Someone like you.'
    "Blowing your mind, 'cause you know what you'll find, when you're looking for things in the sky."
    OMD 'Julia's Song'
  • ZTD
    ZTD Posts: 24,327 Forumite
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    :) Too right. If it's possible without compromising your privacy, would you be able to tell us a little about the kind of systems you test, please?

    IT. But not just the pieces of equipment, but the software running on it, and they procedures in places to keep all the other bits running, and to fix them when the wheels fall off.

    So I've done risk assessments for things like pandemics/weather/disorder situations and how we'd be able to keep things running in a "lockdown". Though I must admit, I didn't predict a deadly disease becoming airborne (ebola), I worked on the assumption that an airborne disease would become deadly ("generic livestock" flu). Doesn't matter that much, the response is much the same.
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    If you were to test vulnerabilities in most systems, the response would by a series of expletives and a lot of nervous bladders and bowels. As it should be - back-patting gets nowhere, recognising problems and working up resilience to them does.

    You'd be surprised. Most administrators are pretty blase about what they "look after". You can tell them how bad it is and get a reply of shrugged shoulders. Maybe even something mumbled about "resources". That's why we tell *everyone*.

    Nothing like something going off in a certain way 2 weeks after we told *everyone* it was in danger of going off in that way. Suddenly "resources" don't seem to be a problem in the face of public humiliation...
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    The other year, phones at my local authority call centre starting ringing off the hook as people rang in to report that their water was off. People always do this, ditto in powercuts, so we quickly know what is going on. We tracked the areas going off-supply by the postcodes of callers. Half the city was off in minutes.

    I spoke to the water company. They had only become aware that there was a problem WHEN THE PUBLIC RANG THEM. Digest that a moment, if you will; there was no monitoring of supply which flagged up the fault, it was the customer going to the sink and finding nowt coming out of the taps.

    Again, that's far more common than you'd think. I offered to provide telemetry for a system, and that was refused - "It's only a problem if a user rings."
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    When I spoke to the water company in the first instance, they didn't know where the fault was, thought it was a water tower. It turned out to be a failed pump. Which took down the water supply to circa 50,000 homes with no warning.

    All credit due, and they got it working again within 2 hours, but they didn't know they had a problem until the public told them, and there was a delay in finding the source before they could even start fixing it.

    Imagine if that electrical pump had no electicity supply. Imagine if the engineers were sick or snowed-in, or couldn't reach the pump due to civil unrest.

    Or imagine if that pump was flooded as per earlier in the year. What would you expect to happen then?
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    Imagine both the mobile phone networks and terrestrial phones unavailable to communicate both the fault and co-ordinate the response.

    They need not be unavailable. There are plenty of simpler scenarios where there is nothing that can be done in any reasonable timescale.

    Subsidence damages the pump and the pumphouse. Can't get in until a structural survey is done and building is made safe. Days pass...
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    Scary, huh? Which is why I store a lot of water. You'd die for want of water in days, but before that you'd endure mental impairment from lack of water, you may be tempted to drink impure water and get sick. You may develop vomiting and diahhreal illnesses which debilitate you and pass infections around your family and even community.

    Today, I have purchased another 2 x 2li bottles of water to add to my cache in the allotment shed. They can sit quietly up there in the big lidded crate, minding their own business. At 17p per bottle, I consider it an excellent way to buy a little peace of mind and to know that if my home supply of bottled water is compromised, I have some more as a Plan B.

    ;) Of course, both might be lost, but we have to work with what we have, don't we?

    You'd have to envisage a scenario where both would be lost. But sometimes disasters are too big.
    GreyQueen wrote: »
    Righty, off now to do some gardening and to add the water bottles discreetly to the cache. Always buy in small unremarkable amounts and don't think for a moment that you will be able to stock up on bottled water once TSHTF; it'll all be gone in minutes.

    But don't forget that there is water in other things as well. Such as canned potatoes/peas etc. Makes the case for buying "Basics" kinds of brands...

    "Canned water! With free potato!"
    "Follow the money!" - Deepthroat (AKA William Mark Felt Sr - Associate Director of the FBI)
    "We were born and raised in a summer haze." Adele 'Someone like you.'
    "Blowing your mind, 'cause you know what you'll find, when you're looking for things in the sky."
    OMD 'Julia's Song'
  • calicocat
    calicocat Posts: 5,698 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Chutzpah Haggler
    ZTD wrote: »
    There is also the small matter of:

    46 Hearsay evidence

    (1)Evidence must not be excluded in restraint proceedings on the ground that it is hearsay (of whatever degree).

    (2)Sections 2 to 4 of the Civil Evidence Act 1995 (c. 38) apply in relation to restraint proceedings as those sections apply in relation to civil proceedings.

    (3)Restraint proceedings are proceedings—

    (a)for a restraint order;

    (b)for the discharge or variation of a restraint order;

    (c)on an appeal under section 43 or 44.

    (4)Hearsay is a statement which is made otherwise than by a person while giving oral evidence in the proceedings and which is tendered as evidence of the matters stated.

    (5)Nothing in this section affects the admissibility of evidence which is admissible apart from this section.


    Which means that someone saying "I heard that she was living the life of Reilly" would be admissible and taken into consideration as evidence that she was living a criminal lifestyle and therefore should have all (not just money) her assets seized.



    Bloomin ekk......

    Thankfully I ended up moving to an area where i'm probably the pauper.......so living here i'm not likely to be accused of that.


    You can't win either way can you.

    Keep it in the bank and it could evaporate into thin air potentially, or be stolen by the powers that be...keep it in cash....and Mr.plod can get his ruddy paws on it.
    Yep...still at it, working out how to retire early.:D....... Going to have to rethink that scenario as have been screwed over by the company. A work in progress.
  • Frugalsod
    Frugalsod Posts: 2,966 Forumite
    Tenth Anniversary Combo Breaker
    siegemode wrote: »

    Please note that these tests are not for the banking sector. They are to try and con us to think that things are perfectly fine. Remember that Dexia collapsed one week after it passed the last stress test. The UK banks are an even bigger mess than they were in 2008. In fact the banks now treat us as unsecured creditors so if you have a lot of money in the bank it could be lost if the bank collapses. Barclays is one of the biggest traders in the derivatives market and that is what brought down the US insurer AIG. AIG would have been allowed to collapse apart from the fact that they are the prime airline insurer and without them, the worlds airlines would have been grounded instantly. So the bail out of AIG was also a massive bailout of banks like Barclays.
    It's really easy to default to cynicism these days, since you are almost always certain to be right.
  • Frugalsod
    Frugalsod Posts: 2,966 Forumite
    Tenth Anniversary Combo Breaker
    I must get some of these. Some of my fridge contents might qualify. My chilli alone could be considered a biohazard purely because of the levels of capsicum.

    1413037526162_wps_32_Yellow_Clinical_Waste_Bag.jpg
    It's really easy to default to cynicism these days, since you are almost always certain to be right.
  • Hi guys, after reading about chimney sweeping I found this advice from North Yorkshire Fire & Rescue Services :

    "chimney sweeping - depending upon what fuel you burn”

    Guidance on frequency is:

    Smokeless coals At least once a year

    Wood Up to four times a year

    Description: Fire ColourBituminous coal Twice a year

    Oil Once a year

    Gas Once a year

    This was more than I do for my multi fuel burner. I need to get mine checked out :eek:
    'Ear all, see all, say nowt;
    Eyt all, sup all, pay nowt;
    And if ivver tha does owt fer nowt -
    Allus do it fer thissen.
  • ZTD
    ZTD Posts: 24,327 Forumite
    calicocat wrote: »
    You can't win either way can you.

    It is not intended that you win.
    calicocat wrote: »
    Keep it in the bank and it could evaporate into thin air potentially, or be stolen by the powers that be...keep it in cash....and Mr.plod can get his ruddy paws on it.

    And even if he does get his paws on it, you can still go to jail for concealing assets. Unless you can prove they don't exist.
    Frugalsod wrote: »
    In fact the banks now treat us as unsecured creditors so if you have a lot of money in the bank it could be lost if the bank collapses.

    They always did treat people as unsecured creditors (unless you have what's called a segregated account). That's why the FSCS was set up in the first place and your account is guaranteed by the FSCS, not the bank.

    People were very trigger-happy if they suspected a bank in trouble and would withdraw their money at the drop of a hat. Compensation schemes were invented to try to cut down on the number of bank runs. They were not set up so people didn't lose money - you still can for deposits above €100,000 and for any size deposit given a "bail-in".

    Segregated accounts have their own problems though - see Barclay's fines in regard to that, and also the re-hypothecation scandal. The FCA are up-tight about segregated accounts - as they should be - and the US regulators are unbelievably lax about them.
    "Follow the money!" - Deepthroat (AKA William Mark Felt Sr - Associate Director of the FBI)
    "We were born and raised in a summer haze." Adele 'Someone like you.'
    "Blowing your mind, 'cause you know what you'll find, when you're looking for things in the sky."
    OMD 'Julia's Song'
  • greenbee
    greenbee Posts: 17,816 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    ZTD wrote: »
    Next week’s simulation, the results of which are expected to be released to the public, is designed to reassure the taxpayers in both UK and the US that their money will not be misused next time when a large financial institution turns out to be not that big to fail.

    If I run a vulnerability test, it is *not* designed to reassure. It is designed to provoke a lot of scrambling around to fix things and not a little brown trousering.

    The test is fluff. Marketing. They've been done in the past for exactly the same reasons. Banks have failed in the past just weeks after passing a stress test - Lehman Bros being the one that comes to mind.

    Reassuring tests are not tests.

    Don't remind me about the Lehman failure *shudders*. We were in the money at time, but I have NEVER had to spend my employer's money so fast (having just done a rights issue AND a bond issue to raise money they wanted all the cash OUT of the banks!).

    As for vulnerability testing, there's always LOTS of scares about the possibility of a 'digital Pearl Harbor' and simulations have been done. But no one wants to spend the money (resources). Hence the need to CYA and document, document, document.

    Just assume that most IT systems are flaky and full of vulnerabilities. There are a few that aren't... and those come as a pleasant surprise :cool:
  • daz378
    daz378 Posts: 1,053 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 500 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    5 days of painkillers and rest and shoulders still not improved....what id give for a good nights sleep... ..still theres people in lot worse situations than me, ... onwards and upwards
  • Pollyjuice wrote: »
    Hi guys, after reading about chimney sweeping I found this advice from North Yorkshire Fire & Rescue Services :

    "chimney sweeping - depending upon what fuel you burn”

    Guidance on frequency is:

    Smokeless coals At least once a year

    Wood Up to four times a year

    Description: Fire ColourBituminous coal Twice a year

    Oil Once a year

    Gas Once a year

    This was more than I do for my multi fuel burner. I need to get mine checked out :eek:

    Cheers pollyjuice oh said "every ten years?" So I smiled and said I'd ask around thank you x
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