proof of working

Sixer

hmc wrote: »

thankyou, lots of differing views
so summing it all up
when my books go into tax office it dosnt need to state names but the invoices to jobcentre for the inwork credit proof,does. so invoices stating date,hrs worked and name and address(does it have to be in full ie could i just put mrs smith s!!!!horpe?) and i have to put what i earn. what is the likely hood of them being contacted as some of them wouldnt be best pleased i know

Hi OP. You didn't answer my question about how much profit you are declaring for the 16 hours of work you're reporting to HMRC.

If this profit is very low (ie under NMW, so less than £96 or so per week) then this is likely to be the reason a compliance check has been triggered for you. It casts doubt on your claim (ie that you work 16 hours or more).

You need to understand that IF the decision maker decides they don't believe you are working for those 16 hours, they will disallow your tax credits claim and you will have to pay it all back. Presumably, this would be a lot of money and would cause you hardship.

It is very much in your interests to provide as much information as will prove to no doubt at all that you are working the number of hours you say you are.

hmc

i havnt declared anything yet
ive only just started saving the recipts for any cleaning bits i buy and for petrol. so they wont count for the dates they want. the job centre havnt singled me out they check every 3 mths apparently that im still working so i get the inwork credit. the tax office is happy with what i told them when i reg self employed in jan. im 16 hrs min wage so thats £97.28 though i am putting some of the prices up but i understand if i earn under £6000 something a yr then i still get my full wtc. unfortunatly if they drop what they pay for my rent i wouldnt be able to manage so maybe no point putting prices up

FBaby

Why would your clients have an issue with confirming that you are doing some cleaning for them? You provide a business to them, they pay you for it, what is the big issue?

If it is such a problem, what you would suggest as evidence that you are indeed doing the work you are claiming to do rather than making it up? That's all they care about, insuring that you are doing what you claim you are, they don't care about your business per se and even less about your clients.

NoBS_2

HappyMJ wrote: »

The HMRC have every right to ask. They can ask for a lot of things but whether they get an answer is up to the individual they do not have to provide name's and addresses of clients if they do not want to. If the income is being declared then that's all they want. The HMRC will require receipts for most expenses claimed. Generally no receipt = no claim. If OP was cleaning a small office then the small business owner would definitely require a receipt but generally most people do not require invoices or receipts it's all just written down as one line in the cash book. i.e Received £30 cleaning for Mrs Smith. At least the OP is declaring it...some people wouldn't bother declaring cash income at all.... A small cash payment here and there will never be found in an audit so some would wonder why they should declare it.

A Compliance exam for Self Assessment says different. My points were being made to help the original poster in the long term when it comes to Self Assessment.

For tax purposes, you need it all. It is best the OP starts out the right way which is what we are all trying to help with in addition to her work grant. I believe the OP wants to get on the best foot with her returning to work after ill-health, it is a minefield to those new to this type of work.

As the OP stated, when she approached them to ask what was required she was told receipts and names and addresses.

Sixer

hmc wrote: »

i havnt declared anything yet
ive only just started saving the recipts for any cleaning bits i buy and for petrol. so they wont count for the dates they want. the job centre havnt singled me out they check every 3 mths apparently that im still working so i get the inwork credit. the tax office is happy with what i told them when i reg self employed in jan. im 16 hrs min wage so thats £97.28 though i am putting some of the prices up but i understand if i earn under £6000 something a yr then i still get my full wtc. unfortunatly if they drop what they pay for my rent i wouldnt be able to manage so maybe no point putting prices up

My apologies, OP. I just read your first post again. This proof is required for the back to work grant and not tax credits. Even so, I would provide complete and truthful information about clients if that's what they're asking for - if you're doing the work, you will need to prove it if you want the grant.

Going forward, do be aware that low-profit self-employment is currently triggering tax credit compliance checks with regards to hours worked. If you are charging £6 per hour (or something very similar to NMW) for cleaning BEFORE you take off any expenses, AND you are the only earner in your household, AND you claim tax credits, then you may fall victim to one of these. We have seen many threads on this very topic of late.

£6 per hour before expenses seems very low for a self-employed cleaner. I live in a very rural, low wage area, and the going rate around here is at least £8 per hour. I'd consider charging more.

Going forward again - how is it that you are working exactly 16 hours? Is it the same hours every week with the same clients every week? Could you find another client or two to move you out of this potential danger zone? Would your health support that? If you look at this from an HMRC point of view, you can see why risk assessment flags get raised when people are reporting below NMW profits for a declared number of hours that exactly match a threshold for benefits payments. You need to avoid being in this danger zone as much as you can and if you can't avoid being in it, you need to keep belt and braces records that uncontestably show you are working and earning what you say you are.

fogartyblue.

Sixer wrote: »

Hi OP. You didn't answer my question about how much profit you are declaring for the 16 hours of work you're reporting to HMRC.

If this profit is very low (ie under NMW, so less than £96 or so per week) then this is likely to be the reason a compliance check has been triggered for you. It casts doubt on your claim (ie that you work 16 hours or more).

You need to understand that IF the decision maker decides they don't believe you are working for those 16 hours, they will disallow your tax credits claim and you will have to pay it all back. Presumably, this would be a lot of money and would cause you hardship.

It is very much in your interests to provide as much information as will prove to no doubt at all that you are working the number of hours you say you are.

Not every business makes a taxable profit equal to or more than the NMW.

Many make losses.
Many just about break even.

Working for 16 hours a week and posting a loss of say £750 does not mean that they are not working those 16 hours!
You might question why somebody would lose £750 and work 16 hours a week to do it - but that is the nature of being self employed!

Sixer

fogartyblue. wrote: »

Not every business makes a taxable profit equal to or more than the NMW.

Many make losses.
Many just about break even.

Working for 16 hours a week and posting a loss of say £750 does not mean that they are not working those 16 hours!
You might question why somebody would lose £750 and work 16 hours a week to do it - but that is the nature of being self employed!

Andy - and please don't shout endlessly about not being Andy - this OP needs advice. Stop messing up threads that might impact on people who are asking for help.

1: I didn't say the self-employed MUST earn NMW.

2: Low profit self-employed people with WTC claims are a target of HMRC at the moment and many people are having their hours questioned in compliance checks. Some are having to repay large sums of WTC.

3: Therefore the OP - a low income, self-employed, sole household earner with a tax credit claim who reports hours that precisely match the threshold for being able to claim tax credits - should keep and maintain comprehensive records which match and prove the information she is reporting to HMRC. If she doesn't, her tax credits (future and those already paid) are potentially at risk.

flutterby_lil

hmc wrote: »

how rude! i am working 16 hrs and as a single parent recovering from cancer i needed a very flexible job that fitted round school. im extreemly proud of myself for getting well enough again to be able to have my own little buisness!!!
so mind your own....

Good for you, well done, pleased to hear you beat cancer and are back on your feet again. Good luck for the future.

fogartyblue.

Sixer wrote: »

Andy - and please don't shout endlessly about not being Andy - this OP needs advice. Stop messing up threads that might impact on people who are asking for help.
.

Do you mind! For a start I'm not called 'Andy' and for a second, I am pointing out errors that others are making in their advice, and certainly not 'messing up threads'!

Go and do your trolling elsewhere!

hmc

thankyou all again for all the advice
i am putting up the price to some of the houses, so i need to ring tax credits,job centre and ipresume tax office? troubler is this will mean i pay even more of my rent and i will be even worse off lol, going to do all my invoices with names and addresses this week end and post off recorded delivery
hadnt heard a thing about this threshold thing
i thought working for myself would be the way to go so i could be flexible for school and if i wasnt feeling well
now im thinking it might all get too much as im no book keeper and if it all gets mucked up and benefits get stopped we will lose our house