vodafone charging me for a phone i didnt have / help!

neal83

If someone is in debt to the creditor irrespective of the type of business the creditors is, the debter has the right to make an information request surrounding there account, this applys to many businesses and industries including the mobile phone business.

i even found a template on money saving expert for making such a request, search in the main search bar 'consumer credit act section 77' and its the first link in rich text format

grumbler

I feel really sorry for your GF if you are the best person she can find to help her.
You seem to be incapable of understanding the basic facts.

• The creditor has to provide the debtor with the information proving the debt, not all the information available for this account. In your case they don't have to provide the records/transcripts of all conversations that they keep.
• Proving the existence of this debt is not a problem for the creditor.
• It is your problem to prove the cancellation of the contract. The only real way to do this is to get the record/transcript.
• If this record exists, the only way to get it is to demand all the information they have on you. This has to be done under the Data Protection Act, not some Consumer Credit Act, and costs up to £10, not £1.

For a request under the DPA, see, for example,
Bank Charges Reclaiming: It's still possible to get £1000s back...
Credit Card Charges: Full guide to reclaim £100s...

neal83

ofcourse you are right about the information that they will provide, and ofcourse they dont have to provide transcripts to calls etc, i never said that.

and having spoken to a vodafone customer service agent and corresponding on here i discovered that she had to send a written request to end her contract with 30 days notice, news to her and myself, normally in the past she has called and request it end with other networks but i suppose this has been at their discretion.

I think it prudent now to call the OFT and ask them what their view on the matter is, there is an obvious disagreement about the interpretation of the law here which i dont feel can be settled.

i will update the forum with their response given their permission to do so.

NFH

neal83 wrote: »

there is an obvious disagreement about the interpretation of the law here which i dont feel can be settled.

Which law?

neal83

well i happen to believe that given the scope of the cca sections 77-79

"This consultation is focused on sections 77/78/79 of the
Consumer Credit Act 1974 which cover the creditor’s or
owner’s duty to give information to debtors or hirers
under fixed-term, running account, and hire agreements.
It clarifies the latest OFT and court understanding of
these sections following a recent High Court judgment on
the matters, and sets out the OFT’s views of relevant
practices which would be considered to be unfair under
section 25 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 – the
'fitness test'." //taken from the OFT guidance on the cca

given that some a mobile phone contract can be interpreted as a 'running account' and if you dont agree with that then you can summise that parts of a mobile phone contract form a credit agreement, thats my interpretation anyway also given that

"The provision of the handset and SIM card […] may be considered to be regulated hire or hire purchase agreement under the CCA depending on whether they remain the property of the mobile phone provider or whether they transfer to the hirer (consumer)."

Other people here think that you can get this information under the data protection act which you may well be able to do, other people believe that your rights solely come under the sale of goods act which im not disagreeing with, some are disputing the fact that you can make an information request to the creditor for

"Under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 you have the right to request certain
information about your credit or hire agreement, from the lender or owner, for a
fee of £1.
If you do want this information about your agreement, including terms and
conditions and an account statement, you can request this from the lender (or
owner, in the case of hire agreements). To do this you must apply in writing and
pay the fee.
What information can you request and what should you expect to receive?
You can ask for a copy of your original contract and for information on the
current state of your account. You can ask for this whether you have a fixed
term loan, a running account loan such as a credit card, or a hire agreement.
The lender needs to provide you with an accurate copy of your contract. The
copy they send you does not have to be the original document, or a photocopy
of the one that you signed, and it can be recreated by the lender, but it should
• show you the original terms and conditions and any later variations
• contain all the information and statements of protection and remedies
required by the Consumer Credit Act 1974
• be easy to read.
The lender should also give you a copy of any documents that are referred to in
your agreement.
If you ask for details of the state of your account the lender must also provide
this to you. Your statement must include the
• total amount that you have paid
• amount that you owe
• separate amounts that make up the total of what you owe and when each
payment is due.
What if the lender does not comply with the request?
Your lender must provide you with the information within 12 working days of
receiving your request. After the 12 days are up, if the lender has not provided
the information then the agreement is unenforceable until they do provide the
information."//again taken from the OFT guidance notes

i think it best to clarify this matter with the oft directly.

kindest regards

NFH

neal83 wrote: »

"The provision of the handset and SIM card […] may be considered to be regulated hire or hire purchase agreement under the CCA depending on whether they remain the property of the mobile phone provider or whether they transfer to the hirer (consumer)."

The handset is transferred to you, governed by the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982, so this wouldn't apply; the handset becomes your property at the time of supply. See Section 78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, which states "The creditor under a regulated agreement for running-account credit, within the prescribed period after receiving a request in writing to that effect from the debtor and payment of a fee of £1, shall give the debtor....". Regardless of whether you look at Section 77, 78 or 79, they all refer to a "regulated agreement".

neal83

Thanks NFH, how would u interpret 'regulated agreement for running-account credit'

NFH

neal83 wrote: »

Thanks NFH, how would u interpret 'regulated agreement for running-account credit'

All the terms are defined in Part II of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. You'll have to read through it, as there are lots of references to other sections with various inclusions and exclusions.

neal83

Thanks NFH you have been a huge help

neal83

As a sidenote what are your thoughts on her not recieving a handset when the contract rolled over