Greece...

ILW

pqrdef wrote: »

An atrocious and appalling statement. Even for you this is shocking.

Anyway, the government presumably got as much revenue as it thought it wanted. Tax rates would have been lower if collection rates had been higher.

That is incorrect, the government based their spending on getting a certain rate of collection. Due to this never being achieved because of massive evasion, they are in the mess they are in. It is actually quite simple and the Greek people are as much to blame as anyone else, but just like to act the part of innocent victims.

Bottom line is that if the taxes had been paid, there would have been more money for public services.

Graham_Devon

EU officials are now drawing up plans to limit withdrawls from cash machines and impose border checks to stop money leaving the country should Greece exit the euro top protect the banks (screw the peasants, it's only their money!)

Sweet!

vivatifosi

Sky News is running a couple of interesting pieces this morning that are well worth catching. In the first they go to Melbourne, Australia. Melbourne has the second largest Greek population outside of Athens. 500,000 Greek/Greek descent live in Australia, mostly Melbourne. There they found:
* Mostly people who were not sympathetic to people who didn't work hard and pay taxes. Few contributing to poor boxes.
* People who have left money in Greece but are now bringing it back.
* National Australia Bank has cut ties with Greek banks.
* Greeks are landing in Melbourne on tourist visas trying to find work among the diaspora.
* Worried Greeks are going back to the country just to vote as they are fearful it will go the wrong way and become a third world country.
* They feel a bond to the mother country that can't be broken even if they don't feel sympathy for all Greeks.

Generali

vivatifosi wrote: »

Sky News is running a couple of interesting pieces this morning that are well worth catching. In the first they go to Melbourne, Australia. Melbourne has the second largest Greek population outside of Athens. 500,000 Greek/Greek descent live in Australia, mostly Melbourne. There they found:
* Mostly people who were not sympathetic to people who didn't work hard and pay taxes. Few contributing to poor boxes.
* People who have left money in Greece but are now bringing it back.
* National Australia Bank has cut ties with Greek banks.
* Greeks are landing in Melbourne on tourist visas trying to find work among the diaspora.
* Worried Greeks are going back to the country just to vote as they are fearful it will go the wrong way and become a third world country.
* They feel a bond to the mother country that can't be broken even if they don't feel sympathy for all Greeks.

There are quite a few Greeks at work and that is the consensus amongst them I would guess. Even the self-described communist reckons that the current situation is bs and that people (all people) need to pay their taxes and not just take.

Most of them describe themselves as Greek despite being Aussie by birth.

homelessskilledworker

Generali wrote: »

There are quite a few Greeks at work and that is the consensus amongst them I would guess. Even the self-described communist reckons that the current situation is bs and that people (all people) need to pay their taxes and not just take.

Most of them describe themselves as Greek despite being Aussie by birth.

We could have a really interesting weekend coming up.

I see it just like you, Greeks have been naughty boys and Girls and not paid their way, now they want to walk off without dealing with their mess. And I see the Germans as mostly innocent

BUT!!

We are where we are, the sort of austerity measure that Greece are having to endure for at least a decade to come will kill it's soul.
Germans need to remember after the First world war that the victorious nations wanted their pound of flesh that probably caused so much hardship in Germany that it caused the 2nd world war.

Something new is needed, but whatever happens Greece cannot go back to it's old ways.

vivatifosi

homelessskilledworker wrote: »

We could have a really interesting weekend coming up.

I see it just like you, Greeks have been naughty boys and Girls and not paid their way, now they want to walk off without dealing with their mess. And I see the Germans as mostly innocent

BUT!!

We are where we are, the sort of austerity measure that Greece are having to endure for at least a decade to come will kill it's soul.
Germans need to remember after the First world war that the victorious nations wanted their pound of flesh that probably caused so much hardship in Germany that it caused the 2nd world war.

Something new is needed, but whatever happens Greece cannot go back to it's old ways.

That's what concerns me too HSW. You can only kick someone so many times when they are down. There's a risk that depression becomes not just an economic but a mental affliction. Then the fog is far harder to pull out of. I don't know the answer, but I think the issue does need to be raised.

Sky did a long interview about half an hour ago (can't link to it as not on web yet) with the female Greek MP who was assaulted. She's an independent although she aligns with the Communists, and I can see sense in a lot of what she says (I'm far more centrist politically). Her view is that Greece needs to go back to the Drachma, but needs to do it in a defined and planned manner, not as part of a crisis. She says that people need to realise that Greece has been in the Euro for 10 years and that five of those it has been in recession. Its quite a long interview, maybe 5-10 mins, but worth watching.

worldtraveller

Greece's new finance minister, Yannis Stournaras has admitted that the country is "off-track" to meet the conditions of its bail-out agreements while his predecessor warned Athens would need three-years to get back on track.

Telegraph.co.uk

OMG! Oh no! Surely not! This is inconceivable! :doh:

michaels

I was going to give you some shock news about bears and woods but too big surprises in one day would be too much?!

worldtraveller wrote: »

Greece's new finance minister, Yannis Stournaras has admitted that the country is "off-track" to meet the conditions of its bail-out agreements while his predecessor warned Athens would need three-years to get back on track.

Telegraph.co.uk

OMG! Oh no! Surely not! This is inconceivable! :doh:

The_White_Horse

i think the eu leaders should have a get together and kick the problem 4 months into the future. then, in 4 months time they can do the same again. and repeat.

dynamic leadership.

sabretoothtigger

michaels wrote: »

I was going to give you some shock news about bears and woods but too big surprises in one day would be too much?!

Its been a while since we or the Greek had bears or that many woods even. Excuses are a waste of time, they spent too much, they are continuing to do so and the plan is in future yep spend too much.

Unsurprisingly the plan is pretty crappy and with no bear to blame just politics

A new plan would be something but its no where in sight just rehashing. Off track is unfortunately order of the day every day till they change the ingredients is my guess