Greece...

purch

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

You're starting to sound remarkably like a Scottish Nationalist...;)

As is Tsipras when he tells the Greeks they can vote No and still stay in the EUR

Generali

purch wrote: »

As is Tsipras when he tells the Greeks they can vote No and still stay in the EUR

The Bank of Greece has a Euro printing press. That's the Greek banks recapitalised right there.

Seriously though, Tsipras is right to say that there is no mechanism for either leaving or being kicked out of the Euro. I wonder if there is any mechanism to prevent the Greeks printing a parallel currency to pay Government workers and recapitalise the banking system?

purch

As far as I can see, no.

In fact they could probably print Euro notes and stick the letter X in front of the number.

This just highlights the whole EU problem, where the idea that the EUR would not work properly, or that a country within the eurozone could get into serious difficulties was never contemplated, so proper mechanisms for dealing with it, and avoiding the kind of shock that will badly effect the entire eurozone were not put in place.

Currently they are just making it up as they go along, and hoping that the shock when it comes is not too severe.

We had better hope so too, as even though we are outside the zone we are not outside it's influence.

wotsthat

purch wrote: »

As is Tsipras when he tells the Greeks they can vote No and still stay in the EUR

I get the sense he might actually believe a no vote strengthens his hand.

He was posting on the DFW board earlier moaning about how he's being hassled for loan payments even though it's a bank holiday.

antrobus

Generali wrote: »

That will work in the short term but at some point Coca Cola Hellenic are going to want paying for all the fizzy drinks they've been delivering.

And since they're in Switzerland, they might want paying in real money.

Generali wrote: »

The Bank of Greece has a Euro printing press. That's the Greek banks recapitalised right there....

Not sure of it's capacity though. I've read suggestions that Greece would use De La Rue.

Generali wrote: »

...Seriously though, Tsipras is right to say that there is no mechanism for either leaving or being kicked out of the Euro. I wonder if there is any mechanism to prevent the Greeks printing a parallel currency to pay Government workers and recapitalise the banking system?

There is no specified mechanism. But one will be found if necessary.

There is no specified mechanism for ending the union between Scotland and England etc. But yet it was and is contemplated, and one would be found if necessary.

cepheus

I heard on R4 Today that the Germans sold Greece dodgy submarines which would only turn one way (presumably right). If it was intended to have a subliminal influence on their political direction they were to be very disappointed!

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/apr/19/greece-military-spending-debt-crisis

Going further back, in 1954 Greece's Finance Minister signed off a 50% debt reduction for Germany, 9 years after war that devastated Europe



Also on the same programme a US professor of economics suggested that the Greek debt should be discussed not in economic classes but ethical ones. He suggested the failed dogma of austerity was imposed on a democratic government which in accordance with all previous evidence of such policies merely increased their debt. However, their electorate was not as gullible as ours!

Thankfully the UK still has some decent politicians left.

Caroline Lucas & Jeremy Corbyn join with union leaders to call for conference to agree cancellation of Greece's debt

http://gu.com/p/4a79n/stw#block-5590181ce4b0c9bda8d8ab11 …

Graham_Devon

Wolfgang Schaeuble has now addressed German TV stating that the Greek government's behavour has been "beyond belief" He claimed that Greece won't be able to destroy Europe and Europe is stable and standing together. (Rather amusing to state Europe is standing together at a time like this!)

Clearly some propoganda going on in Germany.

More amusingly, Junkers head of staff had the audacity to tweet that new Greek proposals were a "good basis for progress".

He was publicly told off by Herr Schaueble who told him to "stop sticking his ore into business which did not concern him".

Or in other words "tow the line" and don't you dare suggest there is any negotitation from the Greek side.

The concern now for Germany appears to be to creating propoganda against Greece. Presumably this would go some way to dampening down any anger should Greece leave Germany with huge losses.

System

Graham_Devon wrote: »

The concern now for Germany appears to be to creating propoganda against Greece. .

Herr Goebbels at a speech in Nuremburg later today will say ....

cepheus

Difficult not to have sympathy with the Greeks in view of this:

Only a small fraction of the €240bn (£170bn) total bailout money Greece received in 2010 and 2012 found its way into the government’s coffers to soften the blow of the 2008 financial crash and fund reform programmes. Most of the money went to the banks that lent Greece funds before the crash.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jun/29/where-did-the-greek-bailout-money-go?CMP=share_btn_tw

Generali

antrobus wrote: »

And since they're in Switzerland, they might want paying in real money.

They're kinda in Switzerland. They're a very modern mess.

Dualisted on the LSE and ASX, mostly owned by Coke in the US and a Luxembourgische(?) company owned by very Greek sounding people.

Put it this way, if you owned a few units in a Greek share fund it would be holding Coca Cola Hellenic. If you did the same in a Swiss fund it would not.

Probably.

Coca Cola Hellenic was probably the most traded Greek non-bank stock prior to the GFC.