water softner help in chosing and is this true

BARGAIN_BOB_2

Needing to replace a now defunct Prismertec softener, I initially decided to buy an electric powered, metered softener (same method as Prismertec).
However after some "Googling" I discovered videos on Youtube presented by Harvey Bowden of Harvey Water Softeners.
(I would recommend these videos to anyone considering a softener as they are both informative and entertaining at the same time).
The Harvey softener has a water powered valve using block salt for it's regeneration process. More "Googling" investigations followed. It was not difficult to find numerous reviews of the Harvey softener or indeed rebadged versions of effectively the same machine. I have to say that the vast majority of those I read were very positive. This led me to consider buying one.
With this in mind I visited Harvey Softeners at Woking and was lucky enough to be offered a guided tour of the factory by Harvey Bowden himself. He proved to be as interesting and informative in person as in his videos. I reckon what he doesn't know about water softeners and their development could be written on a salt crystal!
It was evident on seeing around his factory that quality, performance and reliability are paramount. Stringent quality checks are carried out on components produced by outside manufacturers, as well as those produced in house, which the majority of the parts seem to be. Measurement checks are carried out down to tolerances of a few microns along with pressure testing far higher than that found in normal operating conditions. The hand assembly of the softener is done in strictly clean conditions ensuring that the finished softener performs reliably. All finished softeners are subject to extensive pressure and operational wet working tests.
Having seen the production I could understand why there were so many glowing customer reviews of the softener. Predictably, I have now bought one myself. However as I had previously owned a Prismertec, and had all the necessary pipe-work in place, I was reluctant to pay the installation charge, I also preferred to have one that used salt tablets instead of blocks. Tablets are cheaper, although I have to admit, not nearly as convenient as the blocks.
As luck would have it Harvey's also produce a machine, the Homewater 300, which suits my needs perfectly. It incorporates their innovative control valve but only uses tablet salt.
Installation for me was very easy using 22mm full bore hoses between the softener and existing pipework fittings. As well as the drain and overflow pipes from the softener to their respective existing connections. A very clear and simple, installation and commissioning document is supplied with the unit and this made it all very straightforward. Carefully following the
commissioning procedure ensured that the softener performed exactly as described. I understand that for those people without suitable pipe-work or indeed few DIY skills, the Harvey installation team can make life a lot easier.
My softener has now been in and producing softened water for almost three weeks and all I can say is that it seems so much better than the old Prismertec ever was. The Homewater is whisper quiet. When "hard to soft" conversion is taking place, i.e. when using water, the only noise heard is a gentle ticking and "whirring" emanating from the metering unit, and that is only audible if you stick your ear close to it - I did!
The regeneration process is a little louder; although far quieter than the old Prismertec, coupled with the fact that it only takes a few minutes for the Homewater/Harvey to regenerate.
It is a bit too soon to predict overall salt consumption although the small drop in salt level since installed, bodes well for the future.
Having read back though what I have written makes me realise this sounds like an advert, however I can assure anyone that I have no connection with Harvey's or anyone in the softener business for that matter. I just happen to be someone who hopes to be a satisfied customer long into the future.

Doc_N

BARGAIN_BOB wrote: »

Needing to replace a now defunct Prismertec softener, I initially decided to buy an electric powered, metered softener (same method as Prismertec).
However after some "Googling" I discovered videos on Youtube presented by Harvey Bowden of Harvey Water Softeners.
(I would recommend these videos to anyone considering a softener as they are both informative and entertaining at the same time).
The Harvey softener has a water powered valve using block salt for it's regeneration process. More "Googling" investigations followed. It was not difficult to find numerous reviews of the Harvey softener or indeed rebadged versions of effectively the same machine. I have to say that the vast majority of those I read were very positive. This led me to consider buying one.

Nothing whatever wrong with Harvey softeners, I'm sure - though even at the discounted price they normally sell at they're getting on for twice the price of other equally well made and well regarded softeners.

du02

I'm also looking at fitting a softener and as others have mentioned this seems to be one of the primary sources of information on the web! I have enjoyed reading the thread and thanks to all those that have contributed useful information.

The only thing that puts me off at the moment is the need to run the kitchen tap off before the softener so you are not drinking softened water. In my case this would make the installation less worth while as one of the main reasons for doing it is limescale build up on black granite around the sink and taps.

Is this really still a requirement? I would be getting a plumber to do the installation, the one I have spoken to so far, said that's the only way he would install it. I have a Brita filtered tap, if I used the filtered feed for drinking water, would that eliminate the problem?

Avoriaz

du02 wrote: »

..The only thing that puts me off at the moment is the need to run the kitchen tap off before the softener so you are not drinking softened water. In my case this would make the installation less worth while as one of the main reasons for doing it is limescale build up on black granite around the sink and taps.

Is this really still a requirement? I would be getting a plumber to do the installation, the one I have spoken to so far, said that's the only way he would install it. I have a Brita filtered tap, if I used the filtered feed for drinking water, would that eliminate the problem?

Install a drinking (and cooking) water tap supplying unsoftened water and have every other tap, including hot and cold kitchen taps, on softened water.

That drinking water tap may over time get a build up of limescale but that is easily removed. If you are careful when using it and don't splash water around, then you shouldn't have much issue with the black granite.

All your washing up, cleaning etc can be done with soft water.

du02

Thanks, unfortunately that's not really an option for me, there is no space for it and would involve cutting holes in the granite which I really don't want to. And being careful just isn't going to work long term. As the one who currently cleans the limescale off at the moment, I am extremely careful but with two young kids its just not going to happen...

All I am finding is people saying you have to have an unsoftened tap without any evidence to back that up and the softener manufacturers saying its safe to drink and that any increased sodium levels are tiny...but they then cover their backs by telling you to have a unsoftened tap....Either its safe to drink or its not?

Chunks

Having installed a softener in my house, I decided to give it a clean (been in about a year). Suffice it to say that my cheeky fill of the kettle every now and then (when my Brita filter needed changing and I couldn't be bothered) stopped right then. Some on here have no problems drinking softened water. I don't any more.

du02

Sorry I don't quite get what you mean? You gave the water softener a clean and now you don't drink the softened water?

Doc_N

duo2, the only really safe option is to have a hard water tap left somewhere for drinking/cooking water. The sodium levels will inevitably be higher with softened water, and there's no way of changing that, even with a filter.

You could just take the approach of using cheap bottled water (only about 20p for 2 litres) for drinking/tea/coffee/cooking etc but a hard water tap is the simplest option.

I appreciate your reasons for not wanting one, and only you can make the decision, balancing safety, convenience and cost. I chose the hard tap, as do most people, and it's always the recommended option, but it isn't the only option.

du02

Thanks Doc, I guess that's what it boils down to but I do like to try and make informed decisions.
I still don't understand the argument for not drinking it! Incredibly small increase in the level of sodium in the water, they says its safe to drink but you still need a hard tap to drink from. Either its safe to drink or its not surely?

Doc_N

du02 wrote: »

Thanks Doc, I guess that's what it boils down to but I do like to try and make informed decisions.
I still don't understand the argument for not drinking it! Incredibly small increase in the level of sodium in the water, they says its safe to drink but you still need a hard tap to drink from. Either its safe to drink or its not surely?

You'd have thought so, but I imagine that installers (and everyone else) are covering their backs in case of potential future legal liabilities.

You've probably already seen these, but in case not:


Telegraph:


Q I have been told by my builder that it is bad for you if you drink softened water. Why is that, please?

MW, Andover

A Artificially softened water is not necessarily bad for you. People on low-sodium diets are sometimes told to avoid artificially softened water because the softening process replaces calcium ions with sodium ions, but that doesn’t mean it is “salty”, and a pint of softened water might contain less salt than a slice of bread.

If an ultra-low-sodium diet is essential, medically (such as for heart conditions), then you can use potassium chloride to regenerate the ion-exchange resin beads instead of sodium chloride – although potassium can cause its own problems, and should be avoided by people with kidney problems or diabetes.
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However, water softeners are installed to provide water for washing, not drinking, and most people prefer to drink hard water because it tastes better. That is why it is normal to install one unsoftened “drinking water” tap to the kitchen sink, which is fed direct from the mains, with the rest of the house taking its water via the softener. Water softener suppliers often include a special tap – attached to an under-sink carbon filter – as part of the deal.

Please note that the magnetic or electric water-treatment gadgets widely advertised are not water softeners. They are claimed to prevent limescale forming, but I have not been able to find independent scientific evidence to show that they have any effect at all.

DEFRA:

http://dwi.defra.gov.uk/consumers/advice-leaflets/hardness.pdf