11-year-old may be having sex - what do I do?

ethelhead

Interesting thread, and I think overall I'm tending to side with Fran's take on this - at least until you have much more definite evidence of the likelihood of abuse to bring to the attention of Social Services.

As other posters have said, it can make such a world of difference to a young person to have an honest and open friendship with someone who cares - however seemingly peripheral - in which they are "trusted", valued and respected for who they are. The fact that the child already has some involvement with Social Services, perhaps makes it even more vital that she has a little contact with an "ordinary" family not completely hidebound by often cumbersome & dehumanising policy & procedures.

There's no need to probe unduly & jeopardise her relationship with you. She probably is testing you. If she again brings up the subject of sex in conversation, coolly provide her with some facts about the dangers & risks of underage sex and perhaps even acknowledge that some young people enter into risky sexual relationships precisely in an attempt to feel special & loved when they are not getting their emotional needs properly met! Also, I feel it's important to let her know where your personal boundaries are. Use a hypothetical situation to convey the fact that if you had strong suspicions that a child was being abused you would have a duty as a responsible adult to let her carer and/or Social Services know. This empowers her to be firmly in control of what she chooses to disclose to you.

Whilst it may be unsavoury for us adults to acknowledge, as Jellyhead says - pre-pubescent girls, hormones racing, can be outrageously flirty. Nothing inherently wrong with this - it's a perfectly natural part of growing up. It's how we as adults handle it that is crucial. (Often we don't do a very good job do we? Advertisements showing 5 year olds dressed up as mini-adults in glittery boob tubes & make up spring to mind !!!!!!!)

Finally, can we move away from the idea that to discriminate is inherently bad. Yes I agree it's absolutely wrong to show preference or prejudice on an irrational basis, but it is surely appropriate to note differences/perceive the distinguishing features of a particular set of circumstances and take reasoned actions on that basis. Whatever type of family backgound this girl comes from (I speak as someone who has worked in local authority children's homes) we can be fairly certain that if she has spent any time being "looked after" she will unfortunately have had contact with and learnt from, some very damaged & disturbed children & young people.

Whoops sorry for the long rant!

Caz2_2

Hi all
To Fran i can see your point to some extent, but this girl would not be being reported to social services, she is already known to them as a looked after child, i would think that all though her grandma is her carer and maybe permanently she is still probably under the care of social services due to her previous history of being fostered, they are there to protect and look after her. She will not be in trouble in fact some of this behaviour may be expected. It is also nothing to do with her gran being a single parent/carer, in all honesty i didn't know this. My particular worry was the op planning to talk to her and at first i thought yes she is just being a kid but the flirting with the husband worried me at the age of 11, i have had loads of kids pass threw our house and brought up teenagers and never seen this at such an early age. I have also looked after 2 girls who were sexually abused and given advise on how to handle it by social services and the police and there are strong similarities. My main worry is the talk she could disclose something serious and it needs to be handled very carefully. I am really glad that this girl has got a family who are willing to listen but i picked up that her flirting may be causing confusion between ( sorry i can't find your name without losing this) wife and husband. I hope you are ok Fran. In my opinion social services are brilliant yours may be different.

Savvy_Sue

I think the advice to contact SS is correct. If LeftieM was having any contact with this child in an 'official' capacity - through school, through a church group, through a youth group - then there would be a Child Protection Policy in place, and this 'disclosure' would have to be reported to Social Services. There would be a set procedure for doing this. It would not make any difference what the child's background was. In a way it is easier when there is already a social worker involved, as there should be in this case, but LeftieM does not have to talk to that social worker, she can just speak to the duty social worker.

If LeftieM talks to anyone at the school about what the girl has said, they will have to take it to Social Services.

If LeftieM talks probingly to the girl, there is indeed a risk either of 'leading' her, or putting words into her mouth, or frightening her off even though there is abuse of some kind going on.

If the girl says anything like this in future, it may be worth saying to her that because of LeftieM's concerns for her, she has to tell Social Services. Things like this cannot be kept secret.

I can understand Fran's concerns, but "The welfare of the child is the paramount consideration" (that's from our local council's website on Child Protection). We do not know the truth of what the girl is saying. We are not equipped to establish that truth. SS are fallible, but if we don't give them the information, we can't wonder if they then fail to protect children.

If it helps, here is a link to our local council's basic leaflet on child protection.

rchddap1

Please talk to someone about this. None of us know what this girl is going through, but can we take the risk. I would prefer to talk to someone and be wrong, than to keep quiet and be right.

It doesn't matter what any of us on this board thinks about what is happening to this girl. None of us truly know. What does matter is that something is wrong and simply keeping quiet about it isn't going to help her. To me it doesn't matter if she isn't a family member, she is still a person that needs help. She only has her grandmother and so perhaps she needs someone else to help her.

Yes she could be playing games, and probably is, but it might be real. That chance might be a very small one, but try to think what you would want someone to do for your child if it was them.

Simply to put my mind at rest I would have to talk to someone about her. Perhaps a chat over tea with the grandmother. You don't necessarily have to tell her what the girl has told you, but just feel your way.

Jeryth

We/you have spent 4 pages discussing something in which you are not personally involved; making assumptions and asserting facts and situations without full knowledge of the circumstances.

We should be helping leftieM to soothe her conscience, as SHE is the one asking for advice. The subject is possibly complicated and not as clear cut as the internet might show.

It is easy to act, as has been said above, if there is a Child Protection Policy at work, because we have been trained and have a procedure to follow.

A simple MOP (member of the public) does not have access to the same training, and must rely on instinct.

leftieM's instinct tell her that something is wrong; it is only right and proper that she act on it. Imagine how she would feel if she were to learn in the future that the Social Services SHOULD have been on the case?

I would not use the phrase "report the girl TO the Social Services"; it is not like reporting a crime to the police and giving a witness statement; it is alerting the right department to a SITUATION which might need montoring; but once one has made the phone call, it is out of one's hands. Social Services Child Protection teams have their own procedures, and would much rather find nothing wrong and no action required than to be ignorant of something serious. I'm sorry I sound preachy; this is only my opinion, as is the rest of this thread/board.

LeftieM, please do keep us informed, and good luck. You are doing the right thing just by asking the question.

leftieM

I've just read all the posts. The girl hasn't called around since last Monday so I haven't done anything yet. I discussed the situation with my parents and they have persuaded me not to go directly to the grandmother. It may cause long term difficulties. Someone earlier mentioned that it's odd that I don't know the grandmother when her grandaughter is in and out of the house. If my child was visiting a neighbour I'd make it my business to suss them out. I get the impression that the girl is pretty difficult to live with (from her own comments) and the grandmother is glad of some peace.
Most posters were in favour of contacting social services. I know this girl has a social worker currently (her mother has remarried and I think ss have been trying to heal some rifts there). I agree that I'm not qualified to deal with this on my own.
I'll ring social services today. I feel burdened with this knowledge of what this girl said. I hope she'll be okay.

Poppy9

Leftiem

it must be awfully worrying for you carrying this burden. I know we all made it sound simple and easy contacting Social Services but life is never that simple is it.

I think the girl is so lucky to have you to talk to.

Take care.

smiler1_1

I have just read this post
I think you have done the best thing by contacting social services, this is what they get paid for, and although not easy should take the burden off you a little in the long run.
Good luck
Smiler

Savvy_Sue

leftieM wrote:

Someone earlier mentioned that it's odd that I don't know the grandmother when her grandaughter is in and out of the house. If my child was visiting a neighbour I'd make it my business to suss them out. I get the impression that the girl is pretty difficult to live with (from her own comments) and the grandmother is glad of some peace.

The only thing I'd say in response to the last sentence is that both these statements are probably true! However, there may be a little bit of 'stringing along' or playing for sympathy / attention happening here. In my work situation we sometimes find clients saying that X won't help them with a particular problem, so please will we, when in fact X will help them, but only if the client does something first, or X won't help them because the client has failed to turn up for 3 appointments, or sworn at them, or ... You get the picture.

I think I'd want the grandmother to know who I was (as she probably already does), and that I was happy to see her granddaughter, but that I was sometimes worried about her behaviour / conversation. Maybe. I don't know. I'm sure I'd want the girl to know that she wouldn't be able to string me along with any stories about how awful her grandmother was to her, or how !!!!!! her Social Worker is, without me checking it out ...

Am I making sense? Just had a rare glass of wine ...

jo_b_2

leftieM wrote:

I agree that I'm not qualified to deal with this on my own.
I'll ring social services today. I feel burdened with this knowledge of what this girl said. I hope she'll be okay.

I think you've done the right thing. Social services are there to promote children's welfare as well as helping to protect them. Approaching social services isn't about 'reporting' children as another poster also pointed out. In your case you've just shared information with them because you're worried about a child's welfare.

Hope you feel a bit more comfortable now, as this must have weighed on your mind. Best wishes. Jo.