Atheist and the nativity

balletshoes

PoorCharleyBear wrote: »

I was thinking about how people who believe really feel the need to share their religious persuasion with others particularly atheists.

I wonder how many believers (of whatever persuasion) when they talk to their children about religion, say
'but of course there are plenty of people who don't believe in a god of any sort and these are valid views as well.
I am giving you the opportunity to make your own decision by being well advised on all counts, and whatever you decide is fine by us'

Why do I feel this would not be the case, yet we atheists are expected to teach our kids about religion to be fair and balanced.....

I don't think believers necessarily feel the need to share their religious persuasion with others. Some might, but lots have their own personal relationship with their God, and don't need to let the world know about it.

I'm interested OP - what will you tell your child as she goes through school about what she is taught regarding religion in class? It might actually help that she's in a school with different cultural and religious groups, as I'd expect a lot of the class discussion on all the religions to pretty much begin with "Christians believe that ......" or "Muslims, Sikhs, Hindus, Jews etc etc believe that ........" rather than any kind of definitive instructive approach being taken.

Mojisola

PoorCharleyBear wrote: »

Why do I feel this would not be the case, yet we atheists are expected to teach our kids about religion to be fair and balanced.....

I don't think you could understand a lot of history if you didn't have some knowledge of religions.

Jojo_the_Tightfisted

The 'yes, some people believe that. It's a nice story, isn't it?' does fine for about the first 7 years. After that point, they develop the critical abilities to reach a conclusion themselves, as long as you encourage them to think things through in all aspects of life. By the time they are 12, they have reached their own viewpoint.

Both my DDs are rather good at RE, as they can look at it impartially. They know about buddhism, pagan traditions, Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, Taoism and Shinto. And gained good reports because of their willingness to debate and question. And they both love the Lunar New Year celebrations uptown - I'd say that DD2 is actually quite well informed about Eastern traditions more than any other belief systems, due to her love of manga and anime. So her contributions to school RE lessons are welcomed.


I think some people are wired to feel a spiritual presence and some of us aren't - like some can roll their tongues and some have attached earlobes. That's not to say it exists, but that not everyone feels the sensation that is interpreted as being with a deity.

I admit that I do think it must be nice to feel something and not be absolutely stone cold to what makes others so happy, but DDs being the 2nd Angel or 3rd shepherd from the right never bothered me in the slightest. Sitting through the religious bit done by youth workers from the nearest Baptist Church who obviously had no idea how to operate puppets or make what they were reading in anyway interesting was less comfortable.


Don't worry too much, OP. You'll still be likely to end up with a 12 year old who cannot understand why there are kids in their class who think evolution is a fiendish conspiracy of the devil to trick everyone into not believing in him.

MackemPunk

robpw2 wrote: »

Christ Mass ... do you not see the irony
you are celebrating an event for which you do not have any belief .. that my dear makes you a hypocrite

Most of the traditions we celebrate at this time of year pre-date Christianity by thousands of years, the Christians stole these celebrations to convert people( easter being another example). Jesus(if he even existed) would not have been born on 25th of Dec, decorated trees were part of Saturnalia, the wreath is a Pagan tradition. Thor and Odin both brought gifts, Odin even rode an 8 legged flying horse and of course Mithra was 'born' on the 25th December.

But hey enjoy the holiday your way, but don't tell people off for celebrating it their way.

Person_one

robpw2 wrote: »

im a christian do you have any issue with that ?

Aren't you gay? A large proportion of your fellow Christians have an issue with that.

The_One_Who

PoorCharleyBear wrote: »

I was thinking about how people who believe really feel the need to share their religious persuasion with others particularly atheists.

I often think about how atheists feel the need to share their lack of religious persuasion with those who do have a faith or spirituality of some kind. Unfortunately it is often combined with words such as "idiot", "stupid" and "moron".

Not saying you do this, just that there are a hell of a lot of atheists who feel the need to insult anyone who has a faith.

robpw2

Person_one wrote: »

Aren't you gay? A large proportion of your fellow Christians have an issue with that.

there are some churches who belive being gay is an issue however there are many who do not

erichamster

daska wrote: »

surely the difference is simple? A theist chooses to believe in god/s. An atheist chooses to believe that there is no god/s. An agnostic accepts that there is a possibility that something might or might not exist but refuses to commit themselves because there is no proof.

This interests me, does everyone think we choose our beliefs or lack of beliefs about deities?
I would be inclined to say no as I really don't think I could choose to believe in a god now (even if I wanted to), I just don't and however hard I tried to make my mind up to just believe I never truly would if that makes sense.

I think our beliefs or non beliefs come largely from our upbringing and probably mostly from our parents, as well as friends, education, society etc as we growing up.

I think you can decide to stop believing and live your life according to evidence, but I don't think you can decide to believe in something you don't.

erichamster

robpw2 wrote: »

there are some churches who belive being gay is an issue however there are many who do not

I'm sure there are and obviously the ones who don't have an issue with homosexuality will contain more free thinking, tolerant and moral people, who are of course right not to judge someone based on their sexuality, but they can't really call themselves Christian churches then can they?
That does seem hypocritical doesn't it?
Surely if they're going to call themselves a Christian church they have to follow all the teachings of the Bible? It is after all, all they have to tell them what to do. Who are they to denounce certain parts of it?
In that case why not throw the whole thing out completely and rely on your own morality wholly?

Person_one

robpw2 wrote: »

there are some churches who belive being gay is an issue however there are many who do not

Ok, so you can pick which bits of the bible and which aspects of Christianity you wish to acknowledge and live by.

Please show a bit more tolerance towards people who wish to celebrate Christmas despite not believe in the Trinity etc.