FTSE100 doing well... considering double dip on way?

Blacklight

Total Schools budget for 09/10 was 46.09bn

Spending on teachers pensions for the same period was 10.46bn

It doesn't add up.

Emy1501

leveller2911 wrote: »

Yes its just one of the perks in teaching along with gold plated pensions and "Key worker" status with housing.......... Sorry but you will never justify the Pension perk to the masses when they re contributing towards your pension whilst at the same time not being able to afford their own pension provision..

My question is so where you and others in the boom years when few people wanted to go into teaching? Up until 2009 my wife school could only attract foreign supply teachers which seems a surprise for for a job with wonderful pay, loads of holiday and huge pensions.

Seems the many are now a bit jealous of the security of teaching now their non jobs paying fantastic wages have dried up. It funny as this year 10 people applied for the teaching job that came up recently at the wifes school.

Seems it only now that people seem bothered about teachers perks

leveller2911

Emy1501 wrote: »

My question is so where you and others in the boom years when few people wanted to go into teaching? Up until 2009 my wife school could only attract foreign supply teachers which seems a surprise for for a job with wonderful pay, loads of holiday and huge pensions.

Seems the many are now a bit jealous of the security of teaching now their non jobs paying fantastic wages have dried up.Seems it only now that people seem bothered about teachers perks

I was running my own business which has been going successfully for nearly 25 yrs and contributing to teachers pensions.

I would ask you a straight forward question: Can you in all honesty,hand on heart not feel uneasy with the fact that the Public (many of whom earn 50% of a teachers wage)are paying massively into the Public sector pension schemes when at the same time not being able to provide for their own retirement provision?..

Does it not make you feel the slightest bit uneasy?

Just to add we can't all be teachers otherwise who would be left to pay for our pensions?

jem16

How about some realistic comparisons please?

Professional worker to compare with the professional teacher - ie graduates after 4 years study.

I have 2 sons currently in the private sector, both graduates. Both on approx £30k, one after working for 2 years and the other for 4 years. They have 37 days holiday this year - that's 37/5 as they work 5 days a week so 7 weeks plus 2 days. This taking account of the public holidays.

So £30k divided by 45 multiplied by 48 would give £32k according to your very imaginative "full-time" equivalent.

A teacher after 2 years working in Scotland would be on £23,841 so that's £30,114.

Seems the private sector graduate is ahead so far.

Pension for my sons sees a total of 17% contributed. So with employee tax relief at 20% gives £456.25pm contribution. After 40 years at 5% growth this would give a pot of £679,158. Using an annuity claculator based on retiral of age 60 with a spouse pension and RPI index linking this would give a pension of £19,926. Now of course this totally ignores future wage increases over those 40 years, probable 40% tax relief instead of 20% and uses RPI whereas teachers will now be on CPI. If using index linking of 3% ( closer to CPI) we have a pension of £23,784.

A teacher with a final salary of £35k would see a pension of £23,333 under current final salary conditions.

So the teacher with the "gold plated" pension is actually £461 less.

Blacklight

jem16 wrote: »

How about some realistic comparisons please?

I have 2 sons... They have 37 days holiday this year

Yes that's perfectly realistic.

jem16

Blacklight wrote: »

Yes that's perfectly realistic.

Sorry are you suggesting that they don't?

Or was that really your best answer to the figures quoted?

chucknorris

jem16 wrote: »

Sorry are you suggesting that they don't?

Or was that really your best answer to the figures quoted?

I think he means that not many private sector workers would enjoy such a good holiday allowance. But it's difficult to compare, you have to take into account the salary. I only had between 20 - 25 days plus public holidays in the private sector, but more to the point I went into work at weekends for more days than that, so my NET holiday allowance was actually negative.

However there is no way I would have done that for less than 70k (at today's prices). Nowdays I just wouldn't do it at all, at my age (almost 54) life is now about enjoying it rather than sacrificing it for a better future (that better future has arrived).

Blacklight

jem16 wrote: »

Sorry are you suggesting that they don't?

Or was that really your best answer to the figures quoted?

No.

I'm sure there are other extreme cases like the guy who got the job as a caretaker on an Australian island for 6k a month and had six months holiday afterwards.

You can't extrapolate anything from that just as you can't simply say that 37 days holiday is the norm to prove a point.

jem16

chucknorris wrote: »

I think he means that not many private sector workers would enjoy such a good holiday allowance.

It's not really that good. It's basically 27 days plus the public holidays. That was my point though - it's how the figures are manipulated.

But it's difficult to compare, you have to take into account the salary. I only had between 20 - 25 days plus public holidays in the private sector, but more to the point I went into work at weekends for more days than that, so my NET holiday allowance was actually negative.

The point I was trying to make.

You have to compare workers of similar qualifications.

chucknorris

jem16 wrote: »

It's not really that good. It's basically 27 days plus the public holidays. That was my point though - it's how the figures are manipulated.



The point I was trying to make.

You have to compare workers of similar qualifications.

But there are only 8 public holidays (excluding royal weddings of course) 37-8 = 29. In the private sector you don't usually get Xmas eve and New years eve (at least I didn't), I'm guessing that's where the extra 2 days are coming from.