ceiling collapsed, advice needed!

G_M

The 'without prejudice' is just being used on all communication as a sort of 'just in case'. No real rhyme or reason o it. They knows there's a problem. They know you aren't happy. They're ending the tenancy. They're concerned there might be future dispute so sticking it on everything.

As for your response, separate out the issues, don't link them.
* happy wih rent free period? accept or not.
* happy with 24 hour access? accept or not
* found somewhere to move to? Focus!
* need a reference? Bear that in mind!

Yorkie1

'Without prejudice' is a vastly overused term. They think that simply sticking it on top of a letter means that you are precluded from using the letter in court. It's not always true. Ignore the term and just go for what is right for you.

makoto

That's what I thought, they are probably too concerned and stick it on top of everything. The truth is we don't have the time or the intention to take this further as we just want to leave, and you are right, we should be focusing on that alone.

Just making sure we are not signing or returning anything that could place me in a disadvantageous position later on. We are certainly keeping the responses on each issue separate.

We have thought about the reference as well, we cannot see any reason why they won't give us a good reference, but let's save that for the end. Especially after they have enjoyed over 3 yrs of quiet, hassle free and promptly paying tenants.

Thanks everyone once again!

makoto

We have now moved out after agreeing with the landlords in writing that no further rent should be paid they waived the inventory as we pointed out that several of our belongings were damaged with those at the property.

We had the property professionally cleaned and left everything tidy. We also took pictures of everything just in case.

On our last letter exchange the landlords insisted that we have to show proof of our final bill payments in order to release the deposit from the DPS. We found the request preposterous and simply did not agree or disagree in writing[FONT=&quot], e[/FONT][FONT=&quot]specially since we never fell behind on a single rent payment.[/FONT]

On the last day they insisted we take photos of the meter readings. However, just to do things right, we presented them with a dated form where we added all the readings and both of us signed the two copies, one copy for each party.

After sorting all our bills out we thought we had left this behind us. Unfortunately no, it was not enough for these people who want to keep wasting our time. As soon as we filed for a deposit repayment they contacted us requesting proof of payment copies of all the bills!!! :mad:

Clearly we are dealing with brain damaged or utter stupid landlords whilst they are so close to getting sued. We have decided that enough is enough and now plan to take legal action should this turn into a dispute.

To our understanding there is no requirement under the housing law, our AST, or the DPS to present proof of bill payments to the landlord at the end of the tenancy. The payments are part of the tenant's obligations under the contractual terms but there is no requirement for proof as such.

From the legal perspective it is the onus of the landlord (should they have grounds to contest the deposit) to bring forward evidence to support that, contrary to requesting the other party to prove the opposite.

This is now a matter of principle considering what we have been through.

BitterAndTwisted

Don't bother with legal action for the moment. If the utility bills are in your name/s and not the landlord's then there is no legal relationship between whatever your bill/debts are and the landlord. I would just write a letter to them to that effect and enclose whatever Final Accounts you have received addressed to you from the utility companies with a note that you have settled them. They are idiots who don't know what they are doing so you should not spend a farthing on professional advice until you have to.

Meanwhile the agent/landlord have a deadline in order to claim any deductions from your deposit. Just claim the lot and let them do as they wish.

Post back if they are trying to claim any of your money.

Yorkie1

See this thread for more responses on the utility bill issue:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/3697963

makoto

BitterAndTwisted wrote: »

Don't bother with legal action for the moment. If the utility bills are in your name/s and not the landlord's then there is no legal relationship between whatever your bill/debts are and the landlord. I would just write a letter to them to that effect and enclose whatever Final Accounts you have received addressed to you from the utility companies with a note that you have settled them. They are idiots who don't know what they are doing so you should not spend a farthing on professional advice until you have to.

Meanwhile the agent/landlord have a deadline in order to claim any deductions from your deposit. Just claim the lot and let them do as they wish.

Post back if they are trying to claim any of your money.

They are a total waste of life. We have already claimed the amount, but there seems to be no deadline for the LL to release in this process. We will have to start a single claim process in order to force them to release it.

We are going to send them a notice before action to make a few things clear as you wrote above. We will then initiate a single claim but we have not decided on the dispute, whether we will take it to the ADR service or directly to the county court so that we can be compensated for all expenses.

The LLs are now playing around with our deposit while they are responsible for serious structural damage that put our lives at risk. We became physically and mentally ill during this process, although difficult to prove and we have not received any proper compensation.

olly300

makoto wrote: »

They are a total waste of life. We have already claimed the amount, but there seems to be no deadline for the LL to release in this process. We will have to start a single claim process in order to force them to release it.

We are going to send them a notice before action to make a few things clear as you wrote above. We will then initiate a single claim but we have not decided on the dispute, whether we will take it to the ADR service or directly to the county court so that we can be compensated for all expenses.

The LLs are now playing around with our deposit while they are responsible for serious structural damage that put our lives at risk. We became physically and mentally ill during this process, although difficult to prove and we have not received any proper compensation.

You can only be compensated for the actual losses you suffered because the landlord acted "quickly" and depending how much more stress you want to undergo you are probably better of just chasing to get your deposit back.

If he hadn't acted "quickly" then the EH would have been involved.

If one of you were hospitalised because of the collapsed ceiling the matter would be more complex.

From the thread your actual other losses are the cost of your belongings and half a days work from the collapsed ceiling. However you agreed with the landlord you wouldn't chase him for the belongings in exchange for the inventory not being done. So in reality you can only chase for half a days work, and even though the amount may be a lot more than what other people earn in a week the time/hassle spent in taking it to court would be more than that.

makoto

olly300 wrote: »

You can only be compensated for the actual losses you suffered because the landlord acted "quickly" and depending how much more stress you want to undergo you are probably better of just chasing to get your deposit back.

If he hadn't acted "quickly" then the EH would have been involved.

If one of you were hospitalised because of the collapsed ceiling the matter would be more complex.

From the thread your actual other losses are the cost of your belongings and half a days work from the collapsed ceiling. However you agreed with the landlord you wouldn't chase him for the belongings in exchange for the inventory not being done. So in reality you can only chase for half a days work, and even though the amount may be a lot more than what other people earn in a week the time/hassle spent in taking it to court would be more than that.

We agree on the points you made, we prefer to end this with the recovery of our deposit since the hassle and cost involved may not worth it. However some things are not so simple for us.

The LL failed to repair the ceiling twice, the second time they did not even access the premises, with or without a qualified professional. We received a notice for access to their handyman after the roof works begun. A blatant cowboy judgement without a consultation, even after we wrote to them supporting the ceiling is damaged.

We also had a history of documented recurring leaks coming up again and again (cowboy plumber). Under these circumstances their "acting quickly" should be disregarded because the facts suggest the LL repeatedly failed to put things right and in the case of the ceiling he put us at risk for a long term. In such case the property was dangerous since the cowboy repair and all that rent should be returned.

Secondly, the LL placed our soiled belongings and furniture in the living room consequently exposing us to the rotten dust/mold spores, even though they had been warned of our asthma in writing. They had agreed to clean our belongings (in writing) and place in bags but actually they did not. We had to write to them again to come over and remove their filthy belongings from the living room - unbelievable.

It is worth adding that after that one of us developed bronchitis and had to take several days off sick (all unpaid). The GP appointments/treatment have been documented, so we are not making things up. Whether we could prove the link is a different story.

As for the inventory waiver, we did not ask for it in exchange for our damaged belongings, which did worth a couple of hundred pounds. The property was full of "rubbish" from previous tenants which were documented in a 30 page inventory we did not expect.

We had stored those items in the room that got damaged, hence it was to their interest and our precious time to skip this lengthy process that no inventory clerk would accept anyway. We proposed to check the property together but they were not interested. After moving out we noted they brought a skip on the driveway and disposed of the lot.

We are just glad to be out of there.