Gaddafi's demise

Generali

FTBFun wrote: »

Err, not quite. And if any gas was used, it was tear gas.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alleged_British_use_of_gas_in_Mesopotamia_in_1920

There are counter-claims eg:

http://www.ess.uwe.ac.uk/documents/biowpns.htm

Churchill is certainly regularly quoted as being 'strongly in favour' of using mustard gas against civilian populations. That's obviously not the same thing as using it though.

Spirit_2

Just came upon this thread. It has made me think, and I am certain that I like my despots tried by a court in a fair way, have no desire to Google for piccie's of their corpse, and actively avoid buying newspapers that think such photographs make good front pages.

In the middle of the night last night as I watched the Eurozone deal emerge on the news i also saw a report of MI6's role in colluding with the Libyan secret service to kidnap opponents and their families and return them to Libya.
I felt ashamed, and found myself saying "not in my name". The smug correspondence that came to light from MI6 was immoral on any level.

wotsthat

Spirit wrote: »

Just came upon this thread. It has made me think, and I am certain that I like my despots tried by a court in a fair way, have no desire to Google for piccie's of their corpse, and actively avoid buying newspapers that think such photographs make good front pages.

My daughter (age 13) was quite upset at some of the pictures. We tried to explain what was happening (quite difficult because as the story developed it appears that the UK has helped people, maybe a minority, that behaved like animals). The pictures and videos were quite difficult to avoid in any media.

Meanwhile on Daybreak they were struggling to deal with a story about Ricky Gervais who had used the word 'mong' in a stand-up show. The biggest problem they had on Daybreak was not whether or not they could show pictures of dead despots being dragged around some town (they did) but whether they could show a picture of Ricky Gervais pulling a face (they didn't - it was deemed too offensive).

It's a strange old world we live in.

Road_Hog

Spirit wrote: »

Just came upon this thread. It has made me think, and I am certain that I like my despots tried by a court in a fair way,

Gaddafi knew too much and could finger too many UK & Western politicians. There was no way he was ever going to make it to a trial.

For starters, Libya had nothing to do with Lockerbie and our own government are desperately trying to keep the lid on that one.

timmmers

So. Based on this. Someone else with more military power has the right to invade and interfere in any other sovereign state's affairs?
In WW2 we were happy to have a pact with #Germany as was Russia until Hitler had gone a long way down the bad dictator road (with our knowledge as we had refugees arriving here reporting the ethnic cleansing). He was an aggressor and we helped generally though, and America did too once they found out they were next...late as usual.
Iraq invaded another country, we ignored that for a very long time because it was Iran...and that was a really bloody war. I have a mate who fought in it for Iran against his wishes as a conscript. Second time Iraq invades an oil producer we like and it's different and we step in. We then leave the rebels in #Iraq to be butchered and go back years later for no better reason than a lie. Blair stood in the commons promising it wasn't for regime change and that Saddam had WMDs ...all lies and proven so. Blair and bush are responsible for 100s of thousands of deaths for those lies and the destruction of a country. Saddam was hung by his replacements...in what must have been a very unfair trial.

In Libya we interfered again, if there were human rights abuses (such as the ones in Zimbabwe that we ignore despite it being an ex-colony of ours) there was no mention of it for decades until the general series of arab uprisings. Wonder why?

Personally I think that it's no co-incidence that all these uprisings happened, someone encouraged them and wanted them ....and in this case helped them maintain momentum. Oil is a common denominator. Terrorism isn't anymore as he had taken a hard stance on terrorists for a long time.

One day America or maybe China (the real superpower now) won't like what goes on here ...it's obviousl up to them to come and bomb us into changing and ignore international law as we did in Iraq to get things as required.

He may not have been perfect, but if I had to choose between him and the guy who dropped 2 atom bombs on a defeated Japan's civilians instead of a warning elsewhere to scare Russia....I'd have no difficulty deciding who the monster was.