Fitting a stove. Questions I have.

davemorton

Okay, so to save some money, I have decided to line my chimney myself. I have had a stove for 2 years, but feel it is time to get the chimney lined, and call the council out to approve it. So to help me achieve the holy grail of an approved instalation, and thinking there would be others with similar questions, I thought I would ask my questions here.

Question #1
How do they inspect the install, do they take the register plate off to make sure there is a liner behind it?

Question #2
My stove has a 5" output, which I believe I have to switch to a 6", do I put the adapter straight on the stove, or do I have my initial up-pipe (or double off-set pipe as I am having) first out of the stove, and then the adaptor before the flexable liner?

Question #3
I believe the regs say the distance of none-combustible materials must be a certain distance from the front of the stove, but thois distance halfs if the stove is designed not to be used with the door open, are any stoves designed to be used with their doors open?

Question #4
(Bit of a long shot this question) I have been offered from 'a man in the pub' a length of stove pipe that his brother bought but never used. How do I see/how can I tell if it is stove liner, or just meant to be used for gas fires (or something else?)


Im sure there will be more, but thanks for taking the time to read these. :beer:

muckybutt

davemorton wrote: »

Okay, so to save some money, I have decided to line my chimney myself. I have had a stove for 2 years, but feel it is time to get the chimney lined, and call the council out to approve it. So to help me achieve the holy grail of an approved instalation, and thinking there would be others with similar questions, I thought I would ask my questions here.

Question #1
How do they inspect the install, do they take the register plate off to make sure there is a liner behind it?

Question #2
My stove has a 5" output, which I believe I have to switch to a 6", do I put the adapter straight on the stove, or do I have my initial up-pipe (or double off-set pipe as I am having) first out of the stove, and then the adaptor before the flexable liner?

Question #3
I believe the regs say the distance of none-combustible materials must be a certain distance from the front of the stove, but thois distance halfs if the stove is designed not to be used with the door open, are any stoves designed to be used with their doors open?

Question #4
(Bit of a long shot this question) I have been offered from 'a man in the pub' a length of stove pipe that his brother bought but never used. How do I see/how can I tell if it is stove liner, or just meant to be used for gas fires (or something else?)


Im sure there will be more, but thanks for taking the time to read these. :beer:

Hi Dave i'll help where I can.

#1 No the council wont take the register plate off as it should be sealed by you.

#2 The adaptor should be above the register plate, so from the stove use a 5" flue with an access plate, then through the register plate, install the adaptor onto the 5" flue then connect the liner to that.

#3 Read the regs http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_PDF_ADJ_2002.pdf, some stoves you can run with the doors open yes.

#4 Hmmm personally I wouldnt touch it with a barge pole ! gas liners tend to be lightweight aluminium whereas solid fuel rated ones are stainless steel and of much higher quality.

w50nky

As muckybutt says for the most part from the info you have given.

You do not have to increase the diameter from 5 inch stove pipe to 6 inch liner. Although you must not decrease from say 6 inch to 5 inch. Most reputable installers would never line a flue with 5 inch liner anyway. I would recommend you fit a 6 inch liner as a minimum.

The regs do not specify a minimum length of enamal flue pipe to use from stove to MA adaptor but 600 mm is considered usual as this can withstand the heat from the stove combustion.

12 inches of hearth in front of the stove is required. The distance to other combustables are in the regs and specified by your stove manufacturer.

The inspector does not need to remove the register plate to see a liner as it is not a requirement to line the chimney. In any event if you had back filled with vermiculite it would be very interesting if you were to remove it!!!
He will just check to see what has been done meets the regs.

Is the stove pipe you are being offered enameled stove pipe or flexi twinwall pipe? If enameled it should be ok. If flexi avoid unless you know exactly what it is.

This site is very usefull, full of info. http://www.stovesonline.co.uk/flue-length.html most of what you are asking is covered here allong with the regs.

davemorton

Thanks you two,most appreciated. The reason I thought the adapter need to go on early,was because the end of the double off-set pipe looked like it needed to go straight to flexi-pipe.
The pipe (which I have not seen yet) is a flexi-liner, but I have a feeling it will be a gas one, as a decent double skinned one is not the sort of thing you have lying about for years,but you never know, its still in its packaging, so I will take a peek.
Oh, and Question #5
When I line the chimney, how much movement will I have up and down with the fire-end of the liner once it is attatched to the cowl, as there will be some movement needed to fit it all together.

w50nky

There will be a small amount of movement due to the flue liners flexibility. Also connect the bottom to the stove prior to getting back upon the roof and pulling back up any excess liner and back filling with vermiculite whilst keeping the flue liner central in the flue. You then need to fit the top closure plate and clamp before fitting your chimney pot & cowl if applicable.
You should not need much free play as the spigot on the stove pipe is only around 22mm. You can also buy telescopic lengths of flue pipe which makes the job a doddle if you are connecting to the top of your stove with straight fluepipe.
Make sure you finnish all the work at the bottom of your install before backfilling with insulation as this will restrict movement and support your flue liner (a good thing as it helps during sweeping). Hope this makes sense!

Have fun.

davemorton

w50nky wrote: »

There will be a small amount of movement due to the flue liners flexibility. Also connect the bottom to the stove prior to getting back upon the roof and pulling back up any excess liner and back filling with vermiculite whilst keeping the flue liner central in the flue. You then need to fit the top closure plate and clamp before fitting your chimney pot & cowl if applicable.
You should not need much free play as the spigot on the stove pipe is only around 22mm. You can also buy telescopic lengths of flue pipe which makes the job a doddle if you are connecting to the top of your stove with straight fluepipe.
Make sure you finnish all the work at the bottom of your install before backfilling with insulation as this will restrict movement and support your flue liner (a good thing as it helps during sweeping). Hope this makes sense!

Have fun.

Cheers w50nky, but there in lies more questions.
I intended to use one of those cowls that hold the liner on , making the roof work easier, and saving the need of a top plate.
I was also not planning on using vermicculite, not so much to save money, more to make it easier to correct things if I do anything wrong.
My plan of attack (had been) to get the liner down the chinmey (dog leg shape) then attatch the 5" to 6" adapter to the bottom of liner, attatch the double offset pipe to that, then pull liner back up as far as it needed to go, then attatch to chimney cowl (possibly having this going through the hole in the register plate).
Next lift the stove onto the fireplace and connect the final bits up......
Am I planning this all wrong? Im tring to keep it as easy and simple as possible for the poor mug, erm, close friend that has offered to go onto the roof for me.

welda

I did my own install Oct 08, 5kw MF stove, 5" outlet on top and rear of stove, as stove is sitting on fire hearth (not in inglenook) I used rear stove flu exit.

1. Me up top doing ballerina between the three pots on top of smoke stack, my mate below pulling on rope, while I feed 10 metre of 316/904 SS liner down the chimney. This part for me was a mare! Hit a really bad sticking part about 2.5 metres from bottom of chimney, we nearly gave up, bit of quick thinking and ad-hocing got liner to fireplace. Secured liner to hanging cowel via large jubilee clip. Cowel then secured to pot using 4mm copper wire around the tabs.

2. Cut back excess liner in fireplace, installed 5">6" swept 90 degree reducer. Packed with fire rope, sealed off with fire cement.

3. Got interesting at this point, on my stove purchase I could chose a length of "free stove pipe" I chose the longest @ 1 metre. One end of pipe is male, other is female. Stove positioned to statuary requirments for positioning from combustibles, I could now get a precise measurment from rear 5" stove spigot, to 5" end of 90 degree reducer, lets say for example, dimension is 500, I cut 250mm from each end of stove pipe, welded them together, giving me my required 500mm. Sited stove in it's final position, then installed each end of stove pipe, sealing with fire rope and cement.

4. Now, as stove is sitting out in the room and, space up the lum is tight, I installed a vertical register plate (basically blanking of fire place opening), no way would I be able to work a pistol drill, let alone fit support angle ect, to hold in place a horizontal reg/plate!

Took my sizes from now installed stove flu pipe centres, I had already made up reg/plate from 3mm al/al durbur plate, 90 degree fold at bottom (L), three remaining non formed edges drilled for securing to fireplace. Marked off pipe centre, plasma cut 5"+ hole, using jigsaw, cut plate in half (top to bottom) one half I pop rivet same material on both sides of one half, effectively creating a male and female part (like this plan view ---=<---). Installed female part and secured, slid over male part and secured, oops forgot to say, fire rope all round fire opening including 5" hole to seal off.

I sweep chimney at least twice a year, I sweep from top down, I could sweep direct into stove firebox, but I prefer to remove stove completely, inspect all parts at fireplace level, then re-seal and install after sweeping. Backfilling would not allow this, hence the reason filler is not installed, plus this chimeny is breached, would end up filling two, which is not cost effective.

I realise there are elements outlined above that may be impossible for some people, I'm referring more so to the welding aspects, same for fabbing up the other parts I made. Fortunately I have a reasonably kitted out workshop here at home, which makes any problematic aspect, not so much a problem, what cant be done at home, I do elsewhere, either at work, or calling in favours!!

HTH?
:beer:

davemorton

welda wrote: »

I did my own install Fortunately I have a reasonably kitted out workshop here at home, which makes any problematic aspect, not so much a problem, what cant be done at home, I do elsewhere, either at work, or calling in favours!!

HTH?
:beer:

What you doing next week then? :money::money::money:

welda

davemorton wrote: »

What you doing next week then? :money::money::money:

Resting after my long winded post above

:beer:

w50nky

davemorton wrote: »

Cheers w50nky, but there in lies more questions.
I intended to use one of those cowls that hold the liner on , making the roof work easier, and saving the need of a top plate.
I was also not planning on using vermicculite, not so much to save money, more to make it easier to correct things if I do anything wrong.
My plan of attack (had been) to get the liner down the chinmey (dog leg shape) then attatch the 5" to 6" adapter to the bottom of liner, attatch the double offset pipe to that, then pull liner back up as far as it needed to go, then attatch to chimney cowl (possibly having this going through the hole in the register plate).
Next lift the stove onto the fireplace and connect the final bits up......
Am I planning this all wrong? Im tring to keep it as easy and simple as possible for the poor mug, erm, close friend that has offered to go onto the roof for me.

Sounds like a plan. Getting the dimensions correct will be a bit awkward I suspect as you will need to manipulate the liner a few times but you should get there.

davemorton

Well, been out, bought all the parts, just need to get two unsuspecting friends drunk so I can talk them into offering me their services. Getting excited now! (Oh, and still need to make my register plate too.)