Time off for bereavement?

Savvy_Sue

Personally, I think most people know who's 'worth it' at work, and who isn't. So if a really hard working and valuable employee is given more paid compassionate leave at the discretion of their manager, and a skiver is given less, a good manager will be able to explain why, without going anywhere near discrimination!

Having said that, I'd have been in touch with them at the end of the first week, just to check how things were going and to see when they expected to be back.

We had one colleague off on compassionate leave for 3 weeks, actually not long after they'd started, because a close family member was seriously ill. It had been agreed that if more than that was needed we'd suggest seeing the GP (because it is rather stressful to spend all day and night at a hospital bedside!) But no-one's asked for as long as that following the death of a parent, never mind an about-to-be in-law.

Oldernotwiser

Savvy_Sue wrote: »

Personally, I think most people know who's 'worth it' at work, and who isn't. So if a really hard working and valuable employee is given more paid compassionate leave at the discretion of their manager, and a skiver is given less, a good manager will be able to explain why, without going anywhere near discrimination!

The trouble with that approach is that it could be the skiver who's desolate and racked with grief and the hard worker who's philosophical and takes a bereavement in his stride.

Paid compassionate leave shouldn't be a reward for good behaviour or a punishment for the opposite.

Savvy_Sue

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

The trouble with that approach is that it could be the skiver who's desolate and racked with grief and the hard worker who's philosophical and takes a bereavement in his stride.

Paid compassionate leave shouldn't be a reward for good behaviour or a punishment for the opposite.

But a discretionary policy could involve the skiver being told "take what time you need, but after you've had your 5 days you will need to take leave, paid or unpaid, or see your GP".

Acc72

hcb42 wrote: »

you have a broad guideline, and you use management discretion.

But this does not work in practice and causes more ill feeling and resentment amongst the staff.

It is surely better to have a policy for this type of thing.

Surely it is the managers job to manage the staff properly - i.e. to reward the good employees and to properly manage those who under perform, and not to use an example such as bereavement leave to reward good employees or to effectively punish less regarded employees.

SandC

hcb42 wrote: »

emotions are different. You cannot place an arbitrary value on human life!

(not saying that the employer has to pay for it, but if someone isnt ready to come back to work, they aint ready, no matter how related they are - this is their partners family, and no one here knows the circs)

Absolutely, the policies stated by posters on here seem quite standard, mine is the same. But a sick note could have been provided after a week and then there would be no confusion.

The policies hold a procedure for a bereavement. If the employee is not capable of coming into work beyond that it should be treated as illness. For instance if someone had their pet die I would not be surprised if they needed a day off work - but they would have to treat that as a sick day and complete a self cert, or take a day's hol.

Oldernotwiser

Savvy_Sue wrote: »

But a discretionary policy could involve the skiver being told "take what time you need, but after you've had your 5 days you will need to take leave, paid or unpaid, or see your GP".

That's why I don't agree with a discretionary policy. If it's all laid out and the same for everybody it's much simpler and much fairer.

Oldernotwiser

SandC wrote: »

Absolutely, the policies stated by posters on here seem quite standard, mine is the same. But a sick note could have been provided after a week and then there would be no confusion.

I'm afraid I don't agree with this either. Grieving isn't a medical condition and I don't think that doctors should hand out sick notes for it, except in the most extreme situations.

[Deleted User]

Well I think you have been very generous considering the deceased isn't technically a relative, but each circumstance is different. Our policy is 2 days paid leave which we figure as day/day after it happens and day of funeral. We have a seperate policy for Special leave which is up to a week in any 12 Month period, this also covers things like when your kids are ill. We try to say bereavement leave is for immediate Family like Parents, Siblings and Children, but we once had a guy who's Grandma died and she had brought him up, so we had to be accomodating.

SandC

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

I'm afraid I don't agree with this either. Grieving isn't a medical condition and I don't think that doctors should hand out sick notes for it, except in the most extreme situations.

I know where you are coming from and believe me I couldn't understand those who had 4 weeks off work from my place (maybe I'm just hard as old boots ), but when my dad passed away my brother's wife phoned his HR dept as per procedure and was told he could have one day off. He duly did and went in the next day and ended up going home. He then felt he had no choice but to get a note from the doctor as he didn't feel capable of working.

It was only on his return that he found out that had he spoken to his immediate boss they wouldn't have just read out the stock procedure from the handbook which is what he got from HR.

It's merely a paperwork issue anyway. Grieving is not an illness, no, but if you are incapable of working because you are too upset then it can be classed as stress, anxiety etc. caused by bereavement. The HR dept requires some form of paper trail and therefore a GP note will cover it.

Uncertain

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

I'm afraid I don't agree with this either. Grieving isn't a medical condition and I don't think that doctors should hand out sick notes for it, except in the most extreme situations.

The doctor's first (and legal) duty is to the patient. If, in his professional opinion, it is in his patient's best interest to refrain from work then he is quite entitled to issue a certificate.

You could argue that unless somebody is actually physically incapable of doing any work at all (e.g. in a coma) then it is always a debatable judgement call. Given that the GP will have had around ten years medical training and I suspect you have none I know who's opinion I would value.