Car clamped in own space!!

trisontana

chrisspectre wrote: »

It's absolutely NOT poppycock and a good percentage of clamped vehicles are those parked in homeowners private drives.

Could you car to expand on that statement? Are you saying that individual householders are employing clampers to clamp vehicles they find on their driveways? I think not?

Coupon-mad

chrisspectre wrote: »

It's absolutely NOT poppycock and a good percentage of clamped vehicles are those parked in homeowners private drives.

Never seen any such cases mentioned, ever, on here or on pepipoo. Residents' car parks, yes, but not drives. You are posting poppycock. How many private drives have clamping signage up!! :rotfl:

And in the quoted case it's certainly NOT definitely 'criminal damage' (far from it) if someone removed the clamp carefully without damage, or the person had an 'honest belief' that the clamp was unlawful. Maybe because the person removing the clamp may not be the lessee, could be a friend acting upon that 'honest belief', someone unrelated to the permit scheme.

Even if the lessee removed it they could still have an 'honest belief' defence if the signage was pants, receipt was pants, no SIA licence etc. etc.

We all know that private clamping is a scam 'profession' for people who are thicker than the average gorilla their size, and who cannot get a proper job. :mad:

chrisspectre

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Nope Trevor (or Trevor's mate) you are not telling the truth AGAIN. I see you couldn't defend your view when I picked you up earlier for spreading the myth that cutting off a clamp 'would' result in a criminal damage charge.

Here we go again, you are bringing up the old chestnut about someone being parked on your drive! As if a flippin' metal clamp would help that almost unheard of situation anyway, you and I both know that the fictitional person in your yawningly tedious example would then have a useless car, and a useless lump of metal, and a useless lump of a bouncer/crim/clamper on their drive too!

How about actually listening to what Lynne Featherstone has said?

Clicky House of Commons debate re Protection of Freedoms Bill


QUOTE
Lynne Featherstone:
I draw the hon. Lady’s attention to the fact that the Bill will give landowners explicit permission to move a car sufficiently to get it off their land. That will still be legal under the Bill, because they have no intention to stop the owner driving the car away; they will simply be moving it off their land.
QUOTE


Maybe clampers aren't clever enough to be able to read and decipher Hansard (no apologies, they are as thick as their own necks generally). But I think that on this forum we have posted clearly and often enough to show that we CAN read and decipher a Bill and can challenge it vociferously!

Ergo clampers are not needed and the sooner they are put on the scrapheap (clamps, towtrucks, thugs and all) the better.

Dohh! So are they going to lift it off their land then? Or will they have to call a banned tow truck? And if they do call a banned tow truck will he have to use a banned clamp to secure the vehicle as per health and safety regulations? And if the only place he can move it to is a place where it will likely cause further obstruction, or where it is likely to incur parking charges, will the law be changed to allow him to do this? Or will he have to keep driving around in circles until he finds somewhere he can move it to where it will not incur further charges? And once he has done all this moving, who is going to pay him, the landowner or the person who parked it there? And if he doesn't pay?

trisontana

Are you going to answer our question about all those supposed householders who have had clamped cars they have found on their driveways. Or are you just making it all up?

chrisspectre

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Never seen any such cases mentioned, ever, on here or on pepipoo. Residents' car parks, yes, but not drives. You are posting poppycock. How many private drives have clamping signage up!! :rotfl:

And in the quoted case it's certainly NOT definitely 'criminal damage' (far from it) if someone removed the clamp carefully without damage, or the person had an 'honest belief' that the clamp was unlawful. Maybe because the person removing the clamp may not be the lessee, could be a friend acting upon that 'honest belief', someone unrelated to the permit scheme.

Even if the lessee removed it they could still have an 'honest belief' defence if the signage was pants, receipt was pants, no SIA licence etc. etc.

We all know that private clamping is a scam 'profession' for people who are thicker than the average gorilla their size, and who cannot get a proper job. :mad:

Fair enough, this forum hasn't mentioned clamping on private drives, but others have. The incident i mentioned is not uncommon but then forums such as this one then go on to advise the person who was clamped to take the ppc to court because there were no signs on display saying that clamping and towing were in oeration!
Believe it or not, i'm giving you true to life examples of real incidents.
So if clamping and towing are banned, what rights would a private homeowner have, aside from damging their backs or calling in a banned tow truck.....etc as already mentioned in my previous post.

chrisspectre

trisontana wrote: »

Could you car to expand on that statement? Are you saying that individual householders are employing clampers to clamp vehicles they find on their driveways? I think not?

Typical example: Private homeowner finds a vehicle parked not in her drive but in her front garden. She asks neighbours who it belongs to, no one knows. She calls the police but they have no authority to remove it from private land, but advise her to call in a ppc.
The PPC ask her to put the request in writing, they then remove it and the driver has to pay them for it's release.
The driver then comes on forums like this one, and is advised to take the ppc to court because there were no signs saying clamping and towing were in operation.

What my whole point on these forums is, is that there IS a need for clamping and towing. You don't realise it and can only see it from one point of view. When you realise all the legalities involved in removing a vehicle, you would understand that clamping is a legal requirement prior to towing.
Also, a vehicle cannot simply be removed from the area it is intruding on if that means removing it to a place where it could cause further obstruction, or could incur penalty charges.
Now if your protest is against cowboy clampers, I'm all for it, but where do you draw the line or how do you define a cowboy clamper from a professional clamper?
The fault here has always been with the governments failure to regulate it properly.

Here's an example: If you parked your car on a red route and got towed away, fined and whatever else they might throw at you, you wouldn't expect to complain.
Now if you knew 100% that parking on private land was a serious offence, again you wouldn't complain. But as the law is unclearly defined it means that drivers will continue to take a chance and to continue to intrude where they are not wanted.

Although i understand the hatred for clampers here, the real fault is the governments failure to have regulated it.
You need to also understand that England, especially London, is far different to Scotland!

trisontana

Are you actually saying that private householders are employing clampers to clamp vehicles found on their driveways. I repeat I think you are making it up. If not give us some actual examples.

chrisspectre

trisontana wrote: »

Are you actually saying that private householders are employing clampers to clamp vehicles found on their driveways. I repeat I think you are making it up. If not give us some actual examples.

I can give you examples, but i cannot give you examples now. Be patient and i will eventually make things a bit more clearer.

hillcats

I would just get out my Angle Grinder = hot knife through butter...

trisontana

chrisspectre wrote: »

You need to also understand that England, especially London, is far different to Scotland!

How is it different? have you ever visited any large cities north of the border, such as Edinburgh or Glasgow. They have just as much traffic, but they seem to cope OK without having to employ private clampers.