Christening/ baptism should I or shouldn't i?

Abbafan1972

Slinky wrote: »

Bit of an excuse for a party probably. My sister-and-brother-in-law are having to attend a Christening where none of the family are religious and nobody attends Church except for the occasional wedding or funeral. Pointless exercise with pressure being put on other members of the family to rearrange holiday so they can attend event!

Complete waste of time and money

I agree with you completely, that's why we didn't bother having a christening for our kids and don't tend to attend ones I get invited to as they just bore me to tears.

GracieP

poet123 wrote: »

You have a personal issue for your wish to be removed from the baptismal register, most people do not, it does not make you the official spokesperson for all those who were baptised but who are now atheist.

Actually they do. Across Europe there are nearly 100,000 defection applications which have been stopped by the April 2011 change to Canon Law. And there are several legal groups considering taking a case to the EU court of Human Rights because of it.

I'm not even close to an anomaly. Again, just because you assume something to be doesn't make it so.

poet123

GracieP wrote: »

Off the register of the living Catholics, but still on the register of previous Catholics. Historical precedent is a common tool in political lobbying. (I worked in lobbying for a couple of different NGOs and have seen this done.) Between March 2006 and April 2011 the option existed that people could defect from the Catholic Church and have the baptismal register annotated to reflect this.

However year on year more and more people were defecting and the Church was obviously not pleased about it because in April this year they changed Canon Law to not allow it any more. There are many thousands of people who used to be Catholic but have had their name removed from the baptismal register in that time period. So it has been done and is perfectly possible. But the Church were surprised and unhappy with the growing uptake of defection and without warning ceased to accept those defections 4 months ago.

So you had the option of having your baptism certificate annotated (note, not negated or removed) did you take it up? Quite a large window of opportunity there imo.

I suspect that having someone trawl through the records was a costly exercise, was there a charge?

How many did take up the option?
How many converted to the religion during the same period?

Whilst it may be important to the indivdual involved I doubt the numbers involved would actually alter the % of adherents to the faith overall to any great degree, so your point about political influence is moot.

Lotus-eater

gratefulforhelp wrote: »

Hi LP this seems to have degenerated into telling you why you shouldn't be a Roman Catholic...which wasn't what you asked about, but

Yes and will probably be locked now, as someone will have been offended. Well done those of you who have gone out of your way to mess it up.

poet123

GracieP wrote: »

Actually they do. Across Europe there are nearly 100,000 defection applications which have been stopped by the April 2011 change to Canon Law. And there are several legal groups considering taking a case to the EU court of Human Rights because of it.

I'm not even close to an anomaly. Again, just because you assume something to be doesn't make it so.

Do you have a link to those figures?

margaretclare

poet123 wrote: »

I have re read it and she said

"The idea that 'they can decide for themselves when they're old enough' is fine just so long as they DO decide on something rather than nothing. Wasn't it Hilaire Belloc who said that 'when people stop believing in God they don't believe in nothing, they believe in anything'. And that, in essence, is what's wrong in today's world. We have lost the 'moral compass' that we once had, the Ten Commandments, the Golden Rule.

I take that to mean establish their own moral compass, their own Golden Rule, not just believe that anyone can behave as they wish without consequences or that to have standards is necessary for society to function properly.

We have lost the moral compass that we once had and for many that has not been replaced with a personal compass which knows right from wrong as a separate entity to the religious connotation of right and wrong.

You've got it right.

I'm not too certain about that quotation - it may have come from G K Chesterton rather than Hilaire Belloc. Both, of course, were practising Catholics. DH and I are members of the Methodist Church.

To the person who hates, hates, hates the fact that she was baptised by her parents. It was a drop of water! You had the option to decide for yourself later - it's called confirmation. You'd have something to complain about if you were my DH. He had a bit of the most personal part of himself sliced off when he was 8 days old and thereafter everyone he knew told him - still tells him in fact - that he can't change, has to be what he was 'born' as. At least Christianity doesn't say you were 'born' that way and can't change.

We went to church last evening and the minister - who comes from the same background as DH i.e. actually CHOSE Christianity over the religion he was born into - spoke about the very basics, which is probably why it's fresh in my mind. 'What do you believe, and how does your belief affect the way you live your life?'

Incidentally, the idea of having a baptism just as an excuse for a party, a booze-up in fact, is as bad an idea (worse in fact) than getting a child baptised just to enter a particular school. If you don't believe in it then don't do it.

janninew

I'm not from a religious family, and I haven't been baptised. Most of my friends who are now having children seem to see a Christening as an excuse for a big party/session at the pub! Or as others have said to get their child into a Church school. A lady I work with started to take her daughter to Church every Sunday in the hope of getting into a very over subscribed Church school, when she received her letter in Feb saying she hadn't got in my friend was livid, and hasn't been back to Church since! The admission code for this school is children in care get first priority, then children with learning difficulties, then they look at your Church attendance record and distance to school.

I have no interest in Church and don't believe in the Bible or Jesus etc. I was divorced a few years ago and never forget the comment an elderly (very religious women) who I use to work with, she called me a sinful bi*ch and that I would be going to hell for getting divorced! What gave her the right to judge me! Religion seems so outdated to me, you can be a good person with good morals and have never stepped foot in a Church.

I don't need a book to tell me what's right and wrong. My parents did that when they raised me.

Plans_all_plans

Getting a child baptised when you have no intention of fulfilling the promises you make is wrong in my opinion also. It is also the reason I will refuse to be godmother for my friend's child if she asks me (I think it is more than likely she will) as I know she has no intention of following through with the promises she'll make on the day of the baptism.

BUT, the original poster is a practising Catholic and her children attend Mass with her. All the anti-religion posters are missing that point and are focusing on why they feel religion is not relevant to them. Religion clearly IS relevant to LilacPixie and in her set of circumstances, baptising her children makes the most sense.

lostinrates

January20 wrote: »

I now wish my parents hadn't got me christened because as an adult I consider myself an atheist but there is nothing I can do to revoke my christening. The church won't allow it. I will forever be part of the RC church and it bugs me no end as I had no choice in the matter, and my anti-religion beliefs now are very strong.

fwiw Lilac pixie...I'm in a similar situation to this poster and others who are upset but feel quite differently.

In my immediate birth family my sibling and I...I was christaned RC by my Catholic mother, she was Christianed C of E as demanded by C of E father. My father is a devout aethiest!

I do not believe in any thing I was taught in RC schools, or church but I am very affectionate towards many of the nuns and spiritual guiders I benefitted from knowing during that time. (there were a couple of ''baggages'' but in a way I learned from them too!) Including the priest and Monsignor who were a source of immense support when I decided, in the very serious style only a teenager can muster, to ''renounce my faith''. Sometimes I even still go to church...sometimes I even go to the C of E church which is closest and a strong part of the rural community I live in! (obviously I take communion in neither).

I married a non-believing Jew who also had strong Catholic influoence on his upbringing in Italy. We celebrate some of both religions' festivals, and feel culturally enriched by them, not spiritually damaged.

I remember my First Holy Coomunion (with the Monsignor I later wrote to in my teens when feeling very upset with the Church and empty of Christianity) with only fondness. I was very excited and happy. I never was confirmed. I do not feel ''branded'' or damaged in any way by either ''sacrament'' only that they were not to me ''sacred''.

In many ways I still approach spirituality and self awareness in ways I was taught to ''praise God'' its just that its not about ''God'' for me. The sense of ceremony, collective endevour, and also the benefits of a bloody good sing are all important to me now, and I ''meditate'' on things to think about what I should do, but this certainly stems from how I used prayer time in church...and in honesty the ceremony helps me and I find it enjoyable in its own right.

If we had children we'd be bringing them up in an understanding of both The Jewish faith and Catholosism culturally, with an overiding influence of science, morality, openess to others spiritual beliefs. If I were still a member of a catholic community, even not believing, I would probably opt for a child to feel inclusion and have them baptised, and FHC, but encourage them to make their own arrangements for Confirmation.

edit: also, on discussion with dh years ago we determined if we were to have had a son we would have had him circumcised.

lostinrates

margaretclare wrote: »

. You'd have something to complain about if you were my DH. He had a bit of the most personal part of himself sliced off when he was 8 days old and thereafter everyone he knew told him - still tells him in fact - that he can't change, has to be what he was 'born' as. At least Christianity doesn't say you were 'born' that way and can't change.

.

Many Christian and aethiest men are circumcised. My father, from a very un Jewish background was, it was just ''the norm''. As a matter of fact all the men I have ''known''* have happened to be circumcised, most were of a ''British'' background. A friend of mine, a GP has a special interest in the subject and wrote and researched a paper showing something or other about reduced incidence of certain health problems. Circumcision is not defining of 'what you are'' any more than a name is IMO. And there are plenty of aethiests bearing ''Christian'' names!

edit: * I enjoy a Biblical euphamism, thanks to my ''Catholic'' upbringing.