Solar Panel Guide Discussion

Sirlaughalot

John_Pierpoint wrote: »

Congratulations on debunking more than one saleman's "terminological inexactitude'.

I think you are ready to jump now.

1 - Not getting the basic roof measurements correct - Major embarrassment on their part turning up on the day of installation with a system that wont fit.

If you ever think of building an extension, phone round the double glazing companies and see if they can do a deal on mis-measured replacement windows.

2 - Not one company to date has made reference to the house requiring a Energy Performance Certificate of D or above to qualify for the higher rate of FIT

The (legitimate?) fiddle on this one is to do the certificate after the panels have been installed, unless you live in a Nissen hut or perhaps a Victorian stone cottage, it will pass

3 - Most of the salesman have inspected the electricity meter have at my home nobody has mentioned the implications of a old analogue meter running backwards except for one on line company who has yet to make a survey.

Turn everything in the house off - pull the fuses for effect if you have them - and then film the import meter turning when the the panels are churning out 3kW.
If the muppet cannot understand that ask for Miss Piggy or Kermit.

4 - All salesman bar none have calculated a 50% energy saving on the energy we use during the day even though the household during the working week is unoccupied.

Is it part of the rules like the insurance salesman producing three projections of future growth ?

5 - All salesman bar none have estimated that the system will pay for itself within 4 - 7 years when in reality the figure is closer to 10 - 12 years.

Yes it is an annuity not simple compound interest - just like owning a coal mine - but the return in money terms is guaranteed by a near unsustainable state.

6 - All salesman have quoted a energy inflation rate of between 10-15% in their figures as opposed to the governments DECC figure of 3%.

Cheap coal and gas, without the Chinese taking up the slack (and burning it:D) ?

7 - Three companies have tried to sell me a Poly system!

This link seems to chew over the options, there are loads more similar links.

In the three years I have taken an interest, since a "greenie" friend installed on his roof, I have noticed some improvements in technology.:
Edge panels allowing optimising technology for each panel.
Non generating parts of the array being moved under the panels (ie the aluminium framing and the connecting silver strips)
Mirrored undersides to the panels to reflect any stray light back through the array.
Fancy extra layers to extract electricity from a larger spectrum of sunlight.
However just like cars better panels cost more; though the labour (& profit) part of the installation is the major factor in its cost.

http://energyinformative.org/best-solar-panel-monocrystalline-polycrystalline-thin-film/

8 - Only two companies have mentioned the need to fit a special(dopla) valve on the soil pipe in side the loft most will just cap it (Naughty - Naughty).

Isn't this also needed not, to just ventilate the sewer (so it does not fill up with methane) but to stop the rush of a flush sucking water out of U bends ?

Personally I would not want any sort of valve connected to the sewers inside my loft and would only resort to a replacement for an open stack if there proved to be a problem.

9 - High pressure sales tactics by two of the companies to get me to sign a disclaimer to waiver my 7 day cooling off period in order to qualify for a discount (dead against MCS rules of conduct).

The salesman is also trying to lock out any rival firm - in your situation (lots of companies want your business) I would not agree and have reservations about the firms involved.

10 - No one has mentioned the fitting of snow guards yet all the houses with panels, one exception, have them fitted.

Already debated this one.

11 - Switching of energy suppliers (solar panel) is frowned upon by the big six energy companies according to some installers and they can be quite intimidating when switching and making FIT payments.

Not sure of the current rules but I am pleased to avoid any suggestion of "offset" by having my accounts with two electricity suppliers - divide and rule.

I have changed suppliers - I did not even bother to mention I had PV panels.
About as relevant to the accounts clerk as admitting to having a log burner?

Thanks for your time and effort John,

This miss selling of the returns achieved from solar panels is beginning to have echoes of recent PPI policies or the mortgage endowment policies of the 90`s. No chance of achieving the returns the salesman claim.

But not sure if PV`s come under the category of investment or energy saving?

Thanks

SL

Sirlaughalot

tunnel wrote: »

For exactly DF's response. Once you've informed them your meter is running backwards they'll be out rather sharpish. If they don't come and change the meter, worst case is they'll guess your usage,best case, like DF,any bill would prob be written off:D

Are you planning on changing supplier anytime soon?

I`m in the MSE energy club so difficult to say but will change as soon as the MSE email advises me to do so.

Thanks

SL

EricMears

tunnel wrote: »

If they don't come and change the meter, worst case is they'll guess your usage,best case, like DF,any bill would prob be written off

They can't just guess your usage ! You should demand to know on what basis they made their estimate and then refute it point for point. I wouldn't be in the least surprised to hear that Westondave did just that although EDF might just have had a previous experience with someone else who did so gave in gracefully at an early stage

EricMears

Sirlaughalot wrote: »

I`m in the MSE energy club so difficult to say but will change as soon as the MSE email advises me to do so.

Thanks

SL

Even the MSE energy club expect you to stay with a supplier for at least 3 months (else they don't pay a referral fee !). Realistically it's likely to be even less often that you'd need to change (you probably have a plan guaranteed for a year or so and it's unlikely that a new plan would undercut what was the best plan a few months ago).

Sirlaughalot

WestonDave wrote: »

Practical experience - our meter went backwards after install in May last year. EDF forms had no mention of this until we got the contracts to sign in September at which point we notified of the back running. Took them until December to change the meter, and after some consideration decided our consumption patterns before and after the panel install (and new meter) were so different it would be hard to calculate what we owed for lost import so they just wrote it off.

However, EDF Green Team is now very much more efficient and on the ball than it was this time last year. I wouldn't be surprised if they've got this sorted much better by now so they will be on to it far sooner.

Thanks Dave that`s very reassuring but will all suppliers follow the same path? Doubt it in all honesty they all seem to have their own rules when it comes to customer service!

SL

Sirlaughalot

Martyn1981 wrote: »

Hiya, don't worry too much about the meter, it'll get changed if there's a problem. All you really need to do is make sure you report it asap, just to cover your own back.

EPC's - have you got any idea what yours is? I didn't need one for my original install, but did for the extension. I did an on-line one from the EST's web-site as a guide. It turned out to be surprisingly accurate, so worth a look to see if it's still available.

Another way to check, and quick and simple, look on-line for any properties in your area that are for sale, and that are of similar style and age. They will/should have the EPC's as part of the 'advert'.

Also as John mentioned, the PV iteslf goes towards the EPC rating, so expect it to be little better than a similar property without PV.

Meart.

Hi Trema,

Never had the need to have one(EPC). But i`m sure we are within the limit. Had PVC double glazing fitted last year and have replaced old bulbs for energy saving one`s. Cavity insulation and loft insulation has been passed as decent.

Only issue really is a came with house 25 year old GLOW-WORM boiler that has never let us down and the MSE consensus is to stay with it until it becomes uneconomical to repair.

SL

LS

Sirlaughalot

EricMears wrote: »

IF an electricity company took anything like that long to sort out the issue you should have long since referred the matter to the appropriate regulatory authority !

And if their procrastination kept you an a tariff that was demonstrably worse than an alternative you could otherwise have joined, the regulator would probably insist that you were compensated for your loss. If not you could process a claim via the small claims court.

Thanks Eric,

But seems there could be a lot of effort/anxiety on my part for something (the meter) which is totally out of my control!

SL

Sirlaughalot

EricMears wrote: »

Even the MSE energy club expect you to stay with a supplier for at least 3 months (else they don't pay a referral fee !). Realistically it's likely to be even less often that you'd need to change (you probably have a plan guaranteed for a year or so and it's unlikely that a new plan would undercut what was the best plan a few months ago).

Hi Eric, been on a fixed rate 16 month plan (but can leave with no penalty)with Scottish Power now for about 8 months. The Energy club has sent me about 3 emails to date with cheaper alternatives which i think is fantastic. The reason i have not changed is the feed back on these new companies has yet to be established so i will wait for the next email.

Brilliant that Energy Club!

SL

Sirlaughalot

Thanks for all your help guys. Think i may have opened a can of worms here with the various issues i have raised but it may help other MSE`s when pondering on the issue of PV installation.

On the basis of being forewarned i`m edging against installation until my electricity meter has been replaced with a new/smart meter.

SL

EricMears

Sirlaughalot wrote: »

i`m edging against installation until my electricity meter has been replaced with a new/smart meter. SL

If you ask for a smart meter, you'll be billed for it (no idea how much).

Install SPs with existing meter and if there is a problem it will be replaced without cost to you.