Local Authority Scamera car enforcing No Left Turn by PCN ??

2sides2everystory

I've been stitched up like a kipper :mad:

We were out shopping in London last weekend and enjoyed the fact that we'd chosen a part of London where it is quiet and possible to park for free at the roadside on a Saturday if you interpret the signs correctly ... restrictions Monday to Friday, Restrictions Sunday ... nothing said about Saturday.

Anyway when we came back to the car after lunch we noticed that the Local Authority had got a brand new toy ... a kind of scaled down Google Streetview car with Local Borough Enforcement Team emblazoned on the back and camera on the roof.

We walked past it as we crossed the road to get into the car. My partner asked what on earth it was doing there. I said well maybe they have been tipped off on some regular Anti-Social behaviour and are here to record it.

I thought nothing more of it until a PCN dropped through my letterbox on Saturday morning.

In the absolute clutter of signs I'd not noticed what I think was a single no left turn sign 70 yards in front of where I'd parked the car. I can imagine that the road I'd parked in is a minor 'rat-run' during weekdays, and the road I turned left into is a busy road during weekdays with frequent jams, but there are no traffic lights at this junction and on Saturdays very little traffic.

I'd asked locals about the parking signs before I parked. Very usefully (NOT) whoever enforces the parking restrictions had signposted restrictions for the six days of the week which did not cover the day I was there. So I eventually got that one sorted in my mind, happily did my shopping, and then I get caught by one of the local authority's scamera cars completely oblivious to the offence I committed because of the signage clutter and no particular reason for the sign on a Saturday anyway.

I suppose I'll just have to cough up but it really pains me to think that I am only paying because some bright sparks think they can fund a scamera car and the occupant by tapping people like me for sixty quid for just making a simple mistake that clearly lots make or the car would not have been there.

There was absolutely no safety reason for enforcing this offence upon me at the time I blundered into camera shot. None whatever. The turn I made was 100% safe and the signage prohibiting me from doing it was probably 50% inadequate. No left turns on traffic lights are pretty obvious. No right turn signs are often expected if you have to cut across traffic flows, but a single no left turn sign without a corresponding no right turn sign in a cluttered signage area with no traffic lights is a lottery if you are not a clued-in local (yes I could have legally turned right across two lanes of traffic apparently, but it was the tame left hand turn that did for me

I pride myself in driving in a pretty safety aware manner in London, and then I have to cough up sixty quid for a non-event just because the way they enforce it uses no discretion - in fact it is worse - I saw the guy in the car and thought hell what a job that must be (NOT) - he looked about 6'2" folded into this tiny car, and we'd seen him struggle from the drivers side to sit low down in the passenger seat. I had even thought of knocking on the window and asking 'so what's this in aid of mate?' but I thought perhaps I'd better not in case he was on some kind of meaningful operation.

Obviously I was right - he was on a very meaningful operation - fishing for hapless none-the-wisers like me :mad: and either getting dehydrated in the process or p - ing in a bottle or maybe he only has to catch one like me and is allowed to go back for a cup of tea and a lie down ...

This probably another unexpected ticket I'll just have to cough up and lump it. Driving in London is becoming a lottery and when we lose like this, I suppose we may as well for our sanity just treat it like an additional road tax and move on, but I'd love to challenge it and tell someone exactly what I think of it . The last time I got a £60 ticket was in the Congestion Zone when I was doing a relative a favour by taking them door to door to Heathrow and I did not even realise I was in the zone - I thought I was skirting the edge of it to save money :rotfl: ... I am still not clear where I went wrong on that one - life is too short sometimes, and certainly no fun with people doing jobs like the scamera car operator who feed off non-event type "fines" like the one I'll just have to like or lump. I actually feel bad for being responsible for contributing to sustaining a job like that - I apologise to the other unsuspecting motorists who no doubt have been caught by the same guy still doing the same job again yesterday.

Mankysteve

what the street so we can all have look a google earth? See if your right or not.

pompeyrich

2sides2everystory wrote: »

I've been stitched up like a kipper :mad:

Driving in London is becoming a lottery . The last time I got a £60 ticket was in the Congestion Zone when I was doing a relative a favour by taking them door to door to Heathrow and I did not even realise I was in the zone -.

I sympathise with your plight, I used to love driving in London, not any more, with all the different types of cameras, speed, red light, bus lane, box junctions, cameras watching for anyone who dares stop their car on a yellow line and now this mobile spy machine. It really isn't any fun anymore. I find it too stressful now, not the driving part but the constant fear of attracting a penalty for the simplest of errors.

As you say the parking signs are just so confusing and the penalty for being ticketed or clamped are horrendous.

Can't say I sympathise with your congestion charge problem though, driving up the A3 the CC warnings start just inside the M25 so there is plenty of warning and every entrance to the CC zone has a big red C painted on the road surface, I fail to see how you cold stray into it by mistake.

2sides2everystory

@pompeyrich - I know what you mean but my journey that particular day started in East London and headed for West London. As I am sure you know, you can't use a lot of your "patrolling" resource to constantly identify "C" signs and whether they apply to the road you are about to continue down or a different one where you actually have to make a constant decision to turn off the main drag.

Obviously some roads are signed better than others. For example the other side of the junction where I got done for the no left turn is a minor entrance to the C zone ! (not that it would have mattered at a weekend ... but that's some of the clutter for you for a start) ...
@poontang - oh my, look at that - first you see it then you don't

After sleeping on it, I have realised that the London Borough of Tower Hamlets have actually created a job - a manned no left turn sign. It is part time. The sign in the photo they sent me looks a bit cheap. A bit like a lollipop that a lollipop person has leaned against another sign whilst they've gone for a call of nature. Surely the man isn't cheap, though? And very small though it was, the car and cameras won't be.

Quite a novelty really. How many "manned" road features have we thesedays? Manned railway crossings are now a rarity. There's lollipop persons of course. Very conspicuous, part-time, and of obvious social benefit. Oh and speedcops in various guises.

But I do wonder how this guy describes his job at dinner parties :rotfl:

poontang

2sides2everystory wrote: »

@poontang - oh my, look at that - first you see it then you don't

What's that, can't take the heat, perhaps you shouldn't post.

Never mind, I'm sure you'll feel better after you've paid your 60 quid fine. :money:

AlexisV

Need to see scan of the paperwork and actually see the signage.

Mankysteve

come give us the street view.

2sides2everystory

AlexisV wrote: »

Need to see scan of the paperwork and actually see the signage.

Erm ... I am sure you are well-meaning ... but what would you do with my paperwork ? It has a picture of my car turning left just past a sign that says prohibited left turn ... silly me (That's sixty quid please guvnor :mad:).

I am assuming that the local authority is legally authorised to enforce it as a civil matter relating to the highway like one of their parking PCNs (i.e. not the police). Are you perchance thinking that it might be a new variant of one of those PCNs that can be ignored? I wish it were so, but I don't think so.

@Mankysteve - Streetview doesn't help much because the Streetview photo is old and redevelopment was occurring when it was taken right next to the junction with scaffold almost to the roadside making the 'feel' of the junction somewhat different.

poontang

Mankysteve wrote: »

come give us the street view.

only 1 side to this story.... :rotfl:

2sides2everystory

poontang, you really are a pest.

The junction is at N51 31.01 W00 04.37. I approached it heading west and turned south. As I said, the Streetview photo isn't a very good representation of how it now looks with the scaffolding removed.

But maybe you could make yourself useful and pop down there on your bike and get a completely up to date photo for us (do watch out for mother's and children in your path, won't you please :rotfl:)

poontang

poontang, you really are a pest.

The junction is at N51 31.01 W00 04.37. I approached it heading west and turned south. As I said, the Streetview photo isn't a very good representation of how it now looks with the scaffolding removed.

Here: http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=51.5168333333333,+-0.0728333333333333&aq=&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=23.06853,53.569336&ie=UTF8&ll=51.51699,-0.072889&spn=0.001475,0.00327&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=51.516984,-0.073016&panoid=ylQnN47kkKA9IHBgZ-d5zg&cbp=12,239.67,,0,11.72

?

Looks well-signposted to me. (Not sure what the camera on top of the post is for - you do have to be careful in London...)

But maybe you could make yourself useful and pop down there on your bike and get a completely up to date photo for us

No thanks, but if you're concerned about it, I suggest you do so yourself. Do watch out for the big red 'C' sign just opposite though, they're not terribly visible are they. :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl: