ESA Medical - here we go again!

melbi_uk

dmg24 wrote: »

Your night incident reminded me of an attack I had recently - I was in bed with a new partner, having a bit of sexytime, and he put the quilt over our heads so I couldn't get out. I completely freaked, fought my way out (he thought I was playing!) and and went to the bathroom. He shouted to ask if I was ok, and all he got back was the sound of me throwing up. Needless to say, he hasn't been back since ... Oops!

It has to be the worst illness ever!

Pain can be controlled, it might not make a person completely pain free but it can take the edge off it. Having RA I know my pain can be controlled and even been told I have at least another good 10 years in me to be able to work.

Mental illnesses are still not fully understood and although things have improved, there is still a lot of stigma surrounding it.

When I had my hysterectomy some years ago, my friends and colleagues where brilliant. Sent me flowers, called in to see me regularly etc. As soon as I went off sick with anxiety and depression hardly anyone bothered with me. I felt like a leper. Even when I returned to work it was blatantly obvious that people felt awkward around me.

I have come on - 6 months or so ago, there is no way I could get in the bath without having an anxiety attack. I just felt too close to the water and would panic in case I went under water and drown. I don't get that feeling anymore. :-)

melbi_uk

healy wrote: »

some men as so fussy!

:d:d:d:d:d:d

FTW

healy wrote: »

You are just one person, I know that the percentage of decisions changed at the reconsideration change is low, but my point is that some decisions are changed at that stage.

Maybe so. With personal experience, and others' personal experience, I've not known it to happen at all.

healy wrote: »

It is false because it makes it look like the majority will have a bad experience when that is not the case.

Doesn't cancel out the fact that maybe the patient will have a bad experience. Besides, it's the aftermath of the assessment that has the greatest implications for the patient - not necessarily the assessment itself. Or in other words, when the DWP make their decision known.

And if it's been known to happen, and that company has a (well-founded) notoriety for being 'economical' with truth, then it's best to be prepared for the worst-case scenario.

In this day and age, it pays to be cautious and it pays to be well-prepared. After all, if you expect the worst to happen, it comes as no surprise when it does.

healy

FTW wrote: »

Maybe so. With personal experience, and others' personal experience, I've not known it to happen at all.




Doesn't cancel out the fact that maybe the patient will have a bad experience. Besides, it's the aftermath of the assessment that has the greatest implications for the patient - not necessarily the assessment itself. Or in other words, when the DWP make their decision known.

And if it's been known to happen, and that company has a (well-founded) notoriety for being 'economical' with truth, then it's best to be prepared for the worst-case scenario.

In this day and age, it pays to be cautious and it pays to be wel-prepared. After all, if you expect the worst to happen, it comes as no surprise when it does.

People are only successful at reconsideration in about 10% of cases, as I say it does happen but it is a low %.

I do not deny people have bad experiences, but all I am saying is that the majority do not have a bad experience.

FTW

deeplyblue wrote: »

There is also an absolutely enormous thread on the benefits and work site, recounting the struggle to get the right to record medicals.

http://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/forum?func=view&catid=13&id=20147

If anyone is interested in this topic it's worth going through the whole thing. It's clear that this matter is still very much "work in progress". One man did manage to get the right to record his medical under sensible conditions. However the official position of ATOS (presumably backed by the DWP) is that you can record your medicals if:

1] You provide professional standard twin-recording equipment, which has been calibrated by a qualified sound engineer immediately prior to the medical, so that one tape can be kept by ATOS/DWP and one given to you.

2] The HCP gives their consent to the recording.

Many benefit claimants will not have the contacts or the money to hire professional kit and a sound engineer for however many hours it may take to get the medical done under these conditions (plus waiting time).

The HCP may not give their consent. Some while ago it was asserted that ATOS had instructed all HCPs to refuse to give their consent to any recording. This may not have been accurate, and may have been withdrawn.

Theoretically the battle fought by tb1uk (see link) established that people can record their medicals. However some people are told that they are not permitted to record the medicals. This is usually just stated as a simple fact, and they just sit there and say "No."

If they do agree, then you may find that the only doctors available are all refusing permission, and your medical will have to be postponed.

If you go in, and then start recording they can/do refuse to proceed until the recording is turned off. If you refuse to proceed unless you are allowed to record, then they can say that you refused to attend the medical. At that point they can reject your claim, and refuse you the right to appeal, because you chose not to attend a medical.

There are ways round this - we think. If you really want to record your medical you should try to arrange this in advance with them. That way - and if you are prepared to fight them - you will have a recording that you can use at appeal.

You can go for hidden recording. It is fairly well established (I think) that you can legally record people without their consent. Again, I think the matter is mentioned in the thread I referenced above. However, if they discover that you are recording secretly ATOS will, they say, terminate the interview immediately and probably say that you had behaved in a way which made it impossible to conduct the interview. Once again, they can reject your claim, and refuse you the right to appeal, because you chose not to attend a medical.

I understand why ATOS do not want you recording - it makes it much harder for them to skew the evidence they are supplying. They have a system where you have the right to check whether the "Health Care Professional" is properly registered. Then you are told that you must not write down their name, or even look too hard at the badge.

It is my opinion that most of the campaign to save DLA is doomed to failure. I have suggested before that disability campaigners should pick on achievable targets. One might the restoration of DLA(M) to people in care homes. Another is to have the right to record the medical established by law, or at least by official DWP policy. I think that this measure would reduce the misreporting of medicals which is one of the issues which comes up in appeals.

One sees why ATOS doesn't like the idea.

In that case, it's best not to tell them you're doing it. Atos policy is one thing - but the patient doesn't work for Atos, and therefore the patient isn't bound by their rules and is not obligated to obey them.

Besides, if the 'medical non-attendance' is an issue, then video rather than audio (Mobile in a shirt pocket maybe? Someway to ensure that the camera 'light' isn't shining) would be even better evidence - moreso because the time and date would be on the clip as well.

But, if you go into an Atos assessment without recording, you very may well come out wishing that you had.

I sorely regretted not doing so in my first one, but I didn't make that mistake again with my second assessment.

And, if I'm ever called to attend another, I'd do the same thing again.

FTW

healy wrote: »

I will reply to the paragraph you have now added - hardly a typo.

I keep replying because you are giving false information which does not help anyone. As to hammering away at the same point nearly all your posts say to record the medical, I do not think it is necessary to repeat this endlessly.

Once again, what false information is this, and what's your own experience of such medicals?

FTW

dmg24 wrote: »

I was responding to someone with mental health problems - someone who clearly gets very worried and anxious.

So were my own problems.

dmg24 wrote: »

To act covertly or dishonestly would cause anxiety to anyone with the slightest bit of integrity, it is not in a normal persons nature to act in that way.

Covertly, yes. Dishonestly, no. If anything, you're covering your own back in case they try dishonesty - and that's a distinct possibility. Got burned once, won't happen again.

dmg24 wrote: »

For someone who struggles in social situations that anxiety is going to be magnified considerably.

Not necessarily so in this case, because the patient isn't doing anything illegal or wrong. Only Atos would object to doing it, but that's their problem.

The patient's only doing what Atos is doing on LIMA, and unlike LIMA, it'll be a 100% accurate record of what's taken place.

FTW

healy wrote: »

People are only successful at reconsideration in about 10% of cases, as I say it does happen but it is a low %.

I do not deny people have bad experiences, but all I am saying is that the majority do not have a bad experience.

I've already said what I've said on that one, and it's just going round in circles, so let's just leave it at that.

Hippeechiq

Thanks for the suggestion of recording the medical, but unfortunately I have nothing to record it with, and I'm not entirely sure I'd know what to take notes about....I have to be honest, and say, that I'm all over the place

I wish there was someone else who could think more clearly than I can at the moment, who could accompany us - but there isn't anyone, and I am best equipped for the job really, as it's me who constantly cares for her.

She has no idea of what quantities or the names of all the medications she takes. They change often for one thing, and also I am in charge of giving her her meds daily, and have had to keep them locked away and keep the key with me at all times - so, if, for example, they ask her what meds she's on, am I allowed to answer for her?....well, I'm going to have to, but will that go against her (or me) if she looks to me to help answer her questions?

Obviously we will be taking her meds with us, but if she's asked questions about them, it will be me who has to answer. Like I said before, I'm no shrinking violet, but I don't knowingly want to do something that will put their backs up.

I wish you every luck on Monday too melbi_uk

melbi_uk

Hippeechiq wrote: »

Thanks for the suggestion of recording the medical, but unfortunately I have nothing to record it with, and I'm not entirely sure I'd know what to take notes about....I have to be honest, and say, that I'm all over the place

I wish there was someone else who could think more clearly than I can at the moment, who could accompany us - but there isn't anyone, and I am best equipped for the job really, as it's me who constantly cares for her.

She has no idea of what quantities or the names of all the medications she takes. They change often for one thing, and also I am in charge of giving her her meds daily, and have had to keep them locked away and keep the key with me at all times - so, if, for example, they ask her what meds she's on, am I allowed to answer for her?....well, I'm going to have to, but will that go against her (or me) if she looks to me to help answer her questions?

Obviously we will be taking her meds with us, but if she's asked questions about them, it will be me who has to answer. Like I said before, I'm no shrinking violet, but I don't knowingly want to do something that will put their backs up.

I wish you every luck on Monday too melbi_uk

Thanks Hippeechiq and you too. Do please post back of your experience, as I will.
Good luck x