County Court!!!!!

Chillermiller

I am a landlord, albeit, a new one. I have never rented my property before. The tenants have just moved out after 2.5 years with me. I have not had problems with them until the last 2 months of tenancy. I want HONEST feedback as I plan to sue my tenants and need to be prepared as possible.

1) Inventory: done by myself and LA (who were not a management company). Tenants returned it 3 months late with notes on it that i did not agree with. I did not sign it or return it, or make any further reference to it. All subsequent correspondence about inventory was another copy that I had. All photos are from a distance--not much detail. Not sure where this leaves me? Good that they signed it, or bad for me as they made notes on it which state that there were marks on wall and not deep cleaned etc and I have not signed it. It was never witnessed or dated

2) Check out: no inventory done on day. Was done 4 days after tenant moved out. Tenant present. I took photos before tenant arrived but not during. LA witness to this. Tenant disputed everything we discussed on day. I sent an inventory (not the copy they signed) to them about a month after they left with more details about what I found. No witness, no signature by tenant.

3) I believe my house to be in a state. Marks on walls, rubbish in garden, mold in bathroom, limescale around toilet, carpet in one room badly stained... I have submitted my findings to tenant (including the 40% costs of redecoration), 50% of costs to fix radiator covers (coffee marks and some paint peeled away on the top), my fireplace needs replacing as stained on a portion of it (full costs there) and full cleaning costs (about £500). It amounts to more than the deposit. I want to sue for x2 of deposit as that it what it will cost me from my calculations. My tenants disagree and rejected it.

4) I refuse to used the DPS resolution service as they are soft on tenants. I want my tenants to PAY!!!! They refused me entry to my own house during last month of tenancy--I lost out on reletting it for 3 weeks because of them! I also had to take the time to organise all of the redecoration etc and that too costs money! I am furious! They changed the locks because they didn't want me to enter because I said I was going to--I wouldn't have, I just wanted access! I did x2 but none after that in final weeks. I wanted to take pictures (to prove they were filthy beasts) but denied me this! So, I want to sue and I want to know if I have a case given that there is a disputed and unsigned by me, inital inventory. My photos are general. Checkout inventory was not completed in front of tenant and never signed by them to confirm agreement. My only witness is LA who works for me. All after photos are close up as distance photos do not show damage.

Do I have a case?

PasturesNew

Can you list a breakdown of what you believe to be fair costs that you're hitting them with?

£500 to clean??? Really?

molerat

Hello Artfull

bris

No, they had the right to quite enjoyment of their home which you tried to deny. You have not protected their deposit in one if the required schemes which means it is them who can sue you for their deposit back and in fact 3 times their deposit. You have messed up with the inventory and only have youself to blame. Take this as a lesson learned and do a bit more research into what you should and shouldn't do before you make the same mistakes with your new tenants.

BitterAndTwisted

My opinion? Yet another landlord who sounds like a numpty amateur who hasn't got a clue. But will have ere long.

You are going to get your @rse spanked in court for not protecting the deposit: it's a legal requirement, not a free choice.

Please, please, please join a landlords association before you cause yourself even more heartache and expense!

G_M

Chillermiller wrote: »

I am a landlord, albeit, a new one. I have never rented my property before. The tenants have just moved out after 2.5 years with me. I have not had problems with them until the last 2 months of tenancy. I want HONEST feedback as I plan to sue my tenants and need to be prepared as possible.
Sounds like you've had good tenants and regular rent for a good long time. Is it worth a fight?

1) Inventory: done by myself and LA (who were not a management company). Tenants returned it 3 months late with notes on it that i did not agree with. I did not sign it or return it, or make any further reference to it. All subsequent correspondence about inventory was another copy that I had. All photos are from a distance--not much detail. Not sure where this leaves me? Good that they signed it, or bad for me as they made notes on it which state that there were marks on wall and not deep cleaned etc and I have not signed it. It was never witnessed or datedSo basically the only inventory the tenants have signed/agreed has notes on it? Either you rely on this(including their notes) OR you have no agreed inventory at all to rely on.

2) Check out: no inventory done on day. Was done 4 days after tenant moved out. Tenant present. I took photos before tenant arrived but not during. LA witness to this. Tenant disputed everything we discussed on day. I sent an inventory (not the copy they signed) to them about a month after they left with more details about what I found. No witness, no signature by tenant.
You issues should really have been discussed/documented when they left, not weeks later.

3) I believe my house to be in a state. Marks on walls, rubbish in garden, mold in bathroom, limescale around toilet, carpet in one room badly stained... I have submitted my findings to tenant (including the 40% costs of redecoration), 50% of costs to fix radiator covers (coffee marks and some paint peeled away on the top), my fireplace needs replacing as stained on a portion of it (full costs there) and full cleaning costs (about £500). It amounts to more than the deposit. I want to sue for x2 of deposit as that it what it will cost me from my calculations. My tenants disagree and rejected it.
You need a break-down of evrything you are claiming for, together with quotations for repairs/cleaning etc.
Some of this sounds like wear and tear (2.5 years!) eg limescale. And I agree with Pastures, £500 sounds a lot, though if you have several independant cleaning company quotes.....
4) I refuse to used the DPS as they are soft on tenants.That's your choice I want my tenants to PAY!!!!This sounds too emotive/vindictive. Be objective and treat it as a business decision They refused me entry to my own house during last month of tenancy--That is absolutely their right. They are tenants with a right to 'quiet enjoyment' Whatever you may have put in their contract, they have the right to live there undisturbed till they move out.I lost out on reletting it for 3 weeks because of them! Welcome to the world of letting property. Be grateful you've not had this happening every 6 months. 2.5 years is a good innings.I also had to take the time to organise all of the redecoration etc and that too costs money!Again - welcome to the world of letting. This is a business, with overheads I am furious! What? Because you don't like doing some work to keep your business going...?They changed the locks because they didn't want me to enter because I said I was going to--As a landlord, I would have advised them to do exactly this since you had threatened to illegally enter their home!I wouldn't have, they didn't know that though did they?I just wanted access! I did x2 but none after that in final weeks.So you admit you 2ce entered illegally? This could constitute harrasment (a criminal offence). I wanted to take pictures (to prove they were filthy beasts)they are entitled to live how they like. It is only after they leave that you can make assessments on how they LEAVE the property but denied me this! So, I want to sue and I want to know if I have a case given that there is a disputed and unsigned by me, inital inventory. My photos are general. Checkout inventory was not completed in front of tenant and never signed by them to confirm agreement. My only witness is LA who works for me. All after photos are close up as distance photos do not show damage.

Do I have a case?

If you have a case, it is a weak one.
No reliable check in inventory.
No reliable check out inventory.
Inflated claim.
Poor definition of wear and tear
Poor understanding of LL/tenant law (though this probobly won't affect your success or otherwise in court.)

I have to say the further I read through your post the more sympathy I gained for your tenants. If you talk/act like this in court you won't stand a chance!

Chillermiller

I did protect the deposit albeit eventually. I just do not want to use the resolution service they provide as I heard they are more likely to side with tenants. I could be wrong. I also want more than my deposit as I do not think I am unfair in asking for 40% of painting whole house, full cleaning costs and 50% of the damaged radiators, and full cost of garden work and there were several other key personal items that were damaged and need replacing. I do not think that my £4000 bill is unreasonable. They are unreasonable by denying it!

Where exactly did I fall down with the inventory? I know it is a stupid question but I need to nail it. Was it the photos? The lack of independent witnesses and/or nobody asked tenants to complete it until well after they moved in, or that I have failed to use it for further correspondence with tenants therefore essentially making it void (or would it stand up in court as they signed it and not dated it? no witness?) Please?

sequence

Sounds like your getting all you deserve! I really despise landlords who can't respect their tenants right to quiet enjoyment.

G_M

Chillermiller wrote: »

Where exactly did I fall down with the inventory? I know it is a stupid question but I need to nail it. Was it the photos? The lack of independent witnesses and/or nobody asked tenants to complete it until well after they moved in, or that I have failed to use it for further correspondence with tenants therefore essentially making it void (or would it stand up in court as they signed it and not dated it? no witness?) Please?

Seems like you don't really need us to answer the question as you have answered it yourself!

SouthCoast

I refuse to used the DPS resolution service

Several national charities spent many years campaigning for DPS.

Good luck in court.....................

you will need it.

myhouse_2

Can't comment on No.1 and 2 but it's clear from No. 3 that you haven't got a clue. It's your house in terms of ownership, but when they signed a contract to rent it, it became their house to enjoy - THEIRS. You have no right to barge in and demand entry.
Amateur landlord - and the worst possible kind.