We are all in this together.

lostinrates

bendix wrote: »

get backed into a corner and become even more engrained in their idiotic positions because someone has had the effrontery to challenge them.

Exactly, I think exactly that. Which is why I don't think its a helpful line of debate in such circumstances.

I really like my reputation on here. I'm probably less nice than most people here*, certainly my views are in the unpopular minority...not being totally far removed from yours usually

* e.g. would not stab grandmother for a hamburger or inheritance do believe that people should be more self provident and that enabling many is not kind (national co-dependence) and a more direct system of transfer of wealth....tax me less I'll spend more on local services and many more far more shockingly ''not nice'' believes. And kill chickens etc.

Orpheo

Graham_Devon wrote: »

That's not what is meant, when he says we are all in this together.

He's not saying "we are all exactly the same". He's saying we are all in this mess together, and everyone will have to do their bit.

The rich do they bit, with 50% taxes. There is an argument that they avoid taxes, but then there is the argument that right at the other end of society, people don't contribute a single penny and simply take.

There is also the argument that without the rich, the country wouldn't have the investment it need(ed) to be where it is now.

As I say, I think a lot of people confuse "we are all in this together" with "we are all exactly the same".

I think you are right, but that, in itself, makes it a very poor slogan to use.

ultrawomble

Cameron is of course absolutely correct when he says we're all in it together........

but what he omits to acknowledge is that 4-5% inflation etc. has a much more significant effect on living standards for a minimum wage earner than it does to those experienced by him and his entourage.

Wheezy_2

I've got no issue with the PM having a 30M personal fortune and more than half of the cabinet being multi millionaires.
But please don't tell us "we're all in this together". Because we're not.
It's insulting.

abaxas

Wheezy wrote: »

I've got no issue with the PM having a 30M personal fortune and more than half of the cabinet being multi millionaires.
But please don't tell us "we're all in this together". Because we're not.
It's insulting.

What about the people worse off than you?

Maybe you are insulting them.

esuhl

Politicians never want to talk about specific issues and how they ought to be addressed. They much prefer to talk about abstract concepts and ideology; "what they stand for" and "sending a message".

The average person finds the ideology of a "Big Society" (or whatever) more inspiring and more capable of being the source of endless debate than any real political action. If there was a proposal of some specific action, then people would be divided between supporters and detractors.

Instead, Cameron can "inspire" us and maintain a greater degree of support by referring to abstract concepts, whilst no one is really clear what he is doing. We're being distracted from any truly political decisions that are being made and... if he can convince us that "we are all in this together", we might even see it as "our social duty" to endure hardship and even bad political leadership, when previously we would feel outrage.

Politics died long ago; this is just about managing the psychology of the masses.

Graham_Devon

Wheezy wrote: »

I've got no issue with the PM having a 30M personal fortune and more than half of the cabinet being multi millionaires.
But please don't tell us "we're all in this together". Because we're not.
It's insulting.

I may be confused, or have missed something, but how is it insulting?

abaxas

Graham_Devon wrote: »

I may be confused, or have missed something, but how is it insulting?

It's called socialism.

You want what other people have but cant be bothered to get it yourself.

ultrawomble

abaxas wrote: »

It's called socialism.

You want what other people have but cant be bothered to get it yourself.

But if you inherit the money, you don't have to actually bother getting it either.

Wheezy_2

Graham_Devon wrote: »

I may be confused, or have missed something, but how is it insulting?

Because the slogan "we're all in this together" is untrue.
Recent Tory policies have clearly shown we're not all in this together, by targeting some groups in society particularly hard while leaving others untouched.
When you cut corporation tax while at the same time hiking VAT, don't tell me we're all in this together.
Furthermore, it's infantile.

Like using smileys in posters for the Big Society.