Boycott JAPAN, ICELAND, NORWAY

tomstickland

We are all probably hyprocites by implication to some level in our lives, however, that doesn't mean that we should support hunting of whales, a practice with little justification.

dolly_day_dream

Just a thought - why is hunting whales worse than hunting other animals? If you are prepared to eat animals why are some animals more sacred than others? Because whales may become extinct? We are losing species daily through neglect of the environment. Because whales are intelligent? Pigs are intelligent but I see loads of bacon sarnies being eaten. Please do not misunderstand me. I am totally against the hunting of any animal. I will declare that I am a member of the 'irrelevant fringe group' Greenpeace who campaigned for years to protect the whales.

My personal view is that a whale might well ask why you eat other animals rather than why are you not boycotting the whaling nations.

maow425

LizEstelle wrote:

I would ask people to avoid going off topic here onto irrelevant matters such as renewable energy.

I was just pointing out that these countries are doing something good for the environment, and that if you want to boycott things from Norway, you'd better switch off all the things in your house that uses electricity or gas (gas cookers, GCH etc), as UK power is often generated by using Norwegian gas, especially now that the brand spanking new pipeline has been opened supplying the UK directly with Norwegian gas, taken from the Norwegian part of the North Sea, supplied to the UK by big Norwegian oil companies such as Statoil or Norsk Hydro.

LizEstelle wrote:

Does anyone happen to know whether Ikea stuff, for example, is sourced from Norway in any quantity..?

You do know that Ikea's Swedish? And no, they do not source anything from Norway AFIK, but they do produce a lot of their goods in China - human rights rant, anyone?

The only thing I've heard in the news was that Iceland had killed/captured a whale (not a Minke Whale) but an endangered species. I do not agree with this, but nor do I agree with your view on whaling as long as the species hunted is not an endangered one, and that it is heavily regulated by that country's government - as it is in Norway. I don't recall anything being mentioned in the news that Norway or Japan was in any way connected with this particular incident, only Iceland. But I may very well be wrong.

Also I belive that Norway have been whaling for some years now, but your initial post made it seem like they've just taken it up again. However, if we're all going to boycott these countries for whaling, which seems to offend some people's sensibilities, then we should like a previous poster remarked - boycott other countries for killing cows, sheep, pigs etc. Why can't we attack the real culprits of the fishing industry - the trawlers who sweep the sea clean, overfishing, depleting fish stocks and so on. I can't seem to recall any boycotts or demonstrations in line with anti-whaling actions for years when thinking of the UK's fox hunting! I am fully aware of the fact that this practice has been banned by law, but I didn't see any large scale Japanese/Icelandic/Norwegian demos against this practice...

But if you are dead set on boycotting Norwegian products; Tesco sell a lot of Norwegian seafood such as cod, salmon, prawns, mussels etc. And you'd better check that any of your usual stores do not buy anything that uses dry ice in the transport-chain, as the dry ice is likely to come from a Norwegian company called Yara, a daughter company of Norsk Hydro. Oh, yes - the energy thing... you'll have to switch off your computer, fridge, cooker, telly etc, unless you generate your own power and gas. And I could go on to say something nasty and potentially hurtful here, but I won't. I'll let you have your anti-whaling opinions, as long as I get to have my "UK's crap at renewable energy" opinion.

I love prawns and I do like my prawn mayo sarnies, so I say "Save a Prawn - Kill a Whale!" (humourously intended of course)

LizEstelle

jmarko wrote:

It is entirely unethical to take actions which will have a negative effect on the most vulnerable in society.

If anyone can find such a list, post it and I'll go out of my way to buy from it to help those who, through not fault of their own, would otherwise lose their jobs.

jmarko

I take it you would have 'gone out of your way' in Victorian times to support the mill and mine owners who used child labour in atrocious conditions. I take it you would have 'gone out of your way' to support the Confederate States slavery policy. I take it you would 'go out of your way' to support animal testing of perfumes. I take it you would 'go out of your way' to support ethnic cleansing by certain armies in recent times.

Jobs are involved wherever you look. 'Jobs' equates to 'ethical' with you, right?

Grow up and join those of us who can take a wider view. Sometimes, you have to take a stand.

tr3mor

maow425 wrote:

Hmmm... I'm beginning to wonder if you're one of these people who post on message boards just to wind people up.

Nope, I just get wound up by people saying we should save our environment by covering the whole of in in bloody wind-turbines.

maow425 wrote:

If Iceland and Norway (and the like) can make use of their natural resources (despite public opposition), why can't the UK? We have the resources to produce so much more of our power from renewable sources, but there's not a matching amount of will to do so.

Having learnt more on this subject over the past few days there are vast differences between Iceland's and Norway's use of renewables compared to ours.

Both countries have renewable energy that is reliable. That is to say on any day of the year they can expect pretty much the same output from each source.

Iceland always has, and always will have, superheated steam coming up through holes in the ground. This makes it very easy for them to generate power.

Norway now seems to have over 300 dams, presumably to provide drinking water as well as hydro-electric. All of these should be able to provide the constant supply of water needed to generate electricity.

Britain doesn't have a vast array of fjords or geysers shooting steam out of the ground so we have to rely on the wind or the sun.

The wind and sun aren't constant, therefore they are not reliable.

You cannot generate a high proportion of our electricity from non reliable resources. There is no way to make this add up. Are you saying we should just use less electricity when it's calm and go nuts when there are huge storms?

It is impractical, and I would suggest very unenvironmentally friendly, to store large amounts of electricity.

So, the argument comes down to which non-renewables everyone prefers...

LizEstelle

maow425 wrote:

I was just pointing out that these countries are doing something good for the environment, and that if you want to boycott things from Norway, you'd better switch off all the things in your house that uses electricity or gas (gas cookers, GCH etc), as UK power is often generated by using Norwegian gas, especially now that the brand spanking new pipeline has been opened supplying the UK directly with Norwegian gas, taken from the Norwegian part of the North Sea, supplied to the UK by big Norwegian oil companies such as Statoil or Norsk Hydro.



You do know that Ikea's Swedish? And no, they do not source anything from Norway AFIK, but they do produce a lot of their goods in China - human rights rant, anyone?

The only thing I've heard in the news was that Iceland had killed/captured a whale (not a Minke Whale) but an endangered species. I do not agree with this, but nor do I agree with your view on whaling as long as the species hunted is not an endangered one, and that it is heavily regulated by that country's government - as it is in Norway. I don't recall anything being mentioned in the news that Norway or Japan was in any way connected with this particular incident, only Iceland. But I may very well be wrong.

Also I belive that Norway have been whaling for some years now, but your initial post made it seem like they've just taken it up again. However, if we're all going to boycott these countries for whaling, which seems to offend some people's sensibilities, then we should like a previous poster remarked - boycott other countries for killing cows, sheep, pigs etc. Why can't we attack the real culprits of the fishing industry - the trawlers who sweep the sea clean, overfishing, depleting fish stocks and so on. I can't seem to recall any boycotts or demonstrations in line with anti-whaling actions for years when thinking of the UK's fox hunting! I am fully aware of the fact that this practice has been banned by law, but I didn't see any large scale Japanese/Icelandic/Norwegian demos against this practice...

But if you are dead set on boycotting Norwegian products; Tesco sell a lot of Norwegian seafood such as cod, salmon, prawns, mussels etc. And you'd better check that any of your usual stores do not buy anything that uses dry ice in the transport-chain, as the dry ice is likely to come from a Norwegian company called Yara, a daughter company of Norsk Hydro. Oh, yes - the energy thing... you'll have to switch off your computer, fridge, cooker, telly etc, unless you generate your own power and gas. And I could go on to say something nasty and potentially hurtful here, but I won't. I'll let you have your anti-whaling opinions, as long as I get to have my "UK's crap at renewable energy" opinion.

I love prawns and I do like my prawn mayo sarnies, so I say "Save a Prawn - Kill a Whale!" (humourously intended of course)

And all of this equates to a 'it's difficult so why bother?' rant.

Yes, I knew Ikea was Swedish. Did YOU know Sweden lies next door to Norway, which was why I asked my question about sourcing?

It may well be difficult - and I may make mistakes - but it won't stop me from trying.

maow425

jmarko wrote:

It is entirely unethical to take actions which will have a negative effect on the most vulnerable in society.

Good point!

jmarko wrote:

If anyone can find such a list, post it and I'll go out of my way to buy from it to help those who, through not fault of their own, would otherwise lose their jobs.

jmarko

Well, there are entire communities in Norway dependent on whaling practices, and whale meat is sold in the shops. Mostly in the north of the country, but you can get it in other parts of the country as well. So you could argue that shopkeepers would suffer, thus the staff of the shops, and the ripple effect would eventually have a small but detrimental effect on the entire Norwegian economy. So keep using gas, electricity and buy fish from Norway (look in your local Tesco) and the three big supermarkets also sell Jarlsberg cheese, also from Norway. Oh, and if you have a good deli anywhere near you, they should sell Ski Queen cheese. Brown, tangy and fudgy at the same time - yum! Have a look at http://www.norwegiancheeses.co.uk/ for your nearest supplier, but I know that Crebers of Tavistock sell it, and a couple of delis in Exeter too.

Save a prawn - kill a whale!:rotfl:

Sadierhianne

Whilst i completely agree that killing whales is terrible, boycotting the country isn't really fair - i doubt that the trades people of those countries are responsible for the decisions and they have to make a living.

If the UK started to do something that other countries didn't agree with and business was boycotted - joe public has no say in what governments do - then we would be hit very hard for something that we wasn't responsible for.

Complain to their government but boycotting really isn't an answer. it is also very difficult to know what you are buying that does come from those countries so i guess that unless the whole of society joined in with the boycot it would be fruitless.

However, the passion shown here to save the whale is admirable and with enough support i hope that something can be done to have this decision turned.

Friends of the earth forum - https://www.Foe.org.uk, i think and the greenpeace websites may have stratergies in place for ways to support the cause.

Anne

maow425

LizEstelle wrote:

And all of this equates to a 'it's difficult so why bother?' rant.

It was not an 'it's difficult so why bother?' rant. Just pointing out the things you'll have to give up if you are going to boycott everything from i.e. Norway.

LizEstelle wrote:

Yes, I knew Ikea was Swedish. Did YOU know Sweden lies next door to Norway, which was why I asked my question about sourcing?

If you read one of my previous posts, you'd see that I would have to be as stupid and ignorant as some of those English people on BBC Breakfast this morning not to know where Sweden is.

LizEstelle wrote:

It may well be difficult - and I may make mistakes - but it won't stop me from trying.

Go ahead. You give it a go - by all means stand up for what you believe in. But was this morning's or last night's newsfeed about the Icelandic getting the one whale the trigger for all this? And was Norway and Japan specifically mentioned as having started their whaling again? And maybe another post's link to FOE or Greenpeace would persuade you to take other action than damaging innocent people's livelihood. Someone suggested making a donation to Greenpeace or FOE. WOuldn't that be more appropriate? And by doing so, you could be supporting other ethical and environmental issues as well as doing your bit for the discontinuation of whaling practices in these countries.

You're of course free to have your anti-whaling opinions, while I stand by what I said about prawns.

jmarko

LizEstelle wrote:

Yes, I knew Ikea was Swedish. Did YOU know Sweden lies next door to Norway, which was why I asked my question about sourcing?

Sorry, so are we against whaling or just Scandanvian countries per se?

As I've said before, I think the US is pretty much criminal in most of the environmental things it does. So, using your logic, I reckon we should be boycotting Mexico and Canada! That'll learn 'em! :rolleyes:

jmarko