I can see it coming.....

Brassedoff

Trialia wrote: »

Not all under-25s who are unemployed are employable.

&
KxMx The old don't have a monolopy on being sick. What about those who get ill before the working age?

Chill out won't you? I was being ironic! If they cannot get the 18-25 "able bodied" working, how the hell are they going to get the "disabled" and long term "ill" out to work?

Take me for example? Ok, I will go litter picking! "here's the litter picker Mr Brassedoff, now when you can work out how to use it at the same time as crutches let me know!, "sorry, if I take either hand off, I will fall" I say. " OK, can you drive the van? "sure, do you want me to wait until the morphine wears off and I lose the spaced out look as I think the 18-25's are a bit worried they will end up like me?" I add. "Erm, forget that" says the co-ordinator. Tell you what Mr Brassdoff, let's get you painting out graffiti."

So the wife who acts as my carer packs me off to workfare with my carrier bag of drugs(I will not give her a job yet as she is able bodied and her understanding employer will allow her 3 half or full days a week off to take me to hospital, and the fact the poor !!!!!! is always tired because I am awake all night, just like now keeping her awake).

"Right Mr Brassedoff, here's a brush and bucket please go anddo that wall?" I ask him to carry the bucket, brush, cleaning materials and my bag of drugs, several of which are conYtrolled and are usually locked in a cupboard at home. Now, logistically I need to work out how I can do my brushing, dipping and use the acid it takes to get graffiti off a brick wall using crutches or without falling over. "hello nice Mrs Workfare co-ordinator, can you please hold the bucket for me?". Whoops, I have fallen over and hurt myself again. As I lay there the open tub of brick acid that I knocked over wets through my clothes. "let's get you up Mr Really Brassedoff", says the work co-ordinator ( I assume I have not hurt myself in this). Meanwhile the group of 18 year olds take the p**s out of me for my disability. We will have to get you something you can do. "sorry I cannot come in tomorrow as I have pain clinic, then physio, then my solicitor who is going to sue the government for the anguish, pain, hurt feelings and upset I have had for the past few days. Then I am reporting you to the relevant authorities for breaches of the DDA and Heath & Safety in allowing harm to come to someone you failed to take into consideration when doing your risk assessment."

Now, I know I am being a bit pedantic, but do you really have to beleive every sound bite you hear on the Andrew Marr show, or what the Daily Mail says? I also get sick of people constantly chirping up with, my illness is worse than yours, or my age group had no choice!!!!!

Think of the practical realities. Cherie Booth would have a queue of people around her block waiting to sue for so many things, including breaches of human rights, my favourite being the "Persecuted" one.

If there is 1 job for every 5 applicants at present and that's before they chuck a million local/civil/government employees out on the dole, just when are they going to get around to the 2.4% of the population that covers the disabled or long term ill?

formaldehyde_perfume

I would love to be able to work for my benefits.. But then if I was well enough to work I wouldn't be claiming ESA I would be on JSA. Even when I was relatively well (just about coped 3 years at uni doing graphic design) I would still not have been able to do the community service type jobs such as painting, graffiti cleaning, litter picking etc so I have no idea how they expect me to do it now.

There is also the problem of 'policing' this system. I'm sure I saw panorama or something showing how people who had actually commited a crime and been sentanced to community service were smoking drugs, sitting about, playing about on the kids playground etc - If they can't supervise it for the people already doing it (who, by the way, are doing it as a form of punishment) then how can they expect the jobless or sick+jobless to be more productive?

50Twuncle

formaldehyde_perfume wrote: »

I would love to be able to work for my benefits.. But then if I was well enough to work I wouldn't be claiming ESA I would be on JSA. Even when I was relatively well (just about coped 3 years at uni doing graphic design) I would still not have been able to do the community service type jobs such as painting, graffiti cleaning, litter picking etc so I have no idea how they expect me to do it now.

There is also the problem of 'policing' this system. I'm sure I saw panorama or something showing how people who had actually commited a crime and been sentanced to community service were smoking drugs, sitting about, playing about on the kids playground etc - If they can't supervise it for the people already doing it (who, by the way, are doing it as a form of punishment) then how can they expect the jobless or sick+jobless to be more productive?

Well - when we are all chained together at the ankles - we won't have any choice - I hope that everyone can sing too

".... OH I'VE BEEN WORKING ON THE CHAINGANG...."

Invalidation

And you dont think the Unions will have something to say about this? HAHAHAHAHA
back in the 70's they had an idea about using 16/17 year olds and those in open prisons, working on clearing up canal banks.
It lasted several week before the Unions stepped in and said thes people were taking work from their members
I see the same thing happening here

NorthernLights_2

I'm on ESA right now and very ill, rather not post details. I just wanted to say that, they're talking about it being a spell of 4 30-hour weeks, and not continuous, so if anyone's reading this and feeling alarmed it's a sentence to a virtual workhouse, then it looks not to be quite so bad. I can actuially see how it would help some people, although obviously not people who are sick and have had their ESA terminated at one year.

(As for anyone reading this thinking I'm a sponger because I got sick, I''d happily exchange bodies with you, and then see how you feel.:mad: )

Trialia

Brassedoff, please remember that your tone of voice doesn't always translate well to text, and don't jump on those of us who do not read your sarcasm well.

I've had far too much experience with people dismissing illness and/or disability in under-25s in my life to assume anyone who says something like what you said meant it in a good way. And that's all.

Brassedoff

Trialia wrote: »

Brassedoff, please remember that your tone of voice doesn't always translate well to text, and don't jump on those of us who do not read your sarcasm well.

I've had far too much experience with people dismissing illness and/or disability in under-25s in my life to assume anyone who says something like what you said meant it in a good way. And that's all.

I am sorry, you confuse satire with sarcasium! Did I say anything about Anyone who has a disability in that age group. Get out your little bubble of self pity and realise in the world there are thousands of 18 year olds every year joining the dole who are perfectly able bodied. These people have no job, or hope of one at present. So, getting back to the point before you so petulantly interrupted, how will they get them doing workfare before they get around to all those (and just stroke yours and my needs) 18-60 year olds with "illnesses" or "disablement's"

Now that I have got my bit of sarcasm out of the way, they were sound bites, or "Daily Mail" tag lines to get sales or stroke the needs of their middle class readers!

Think of, Health & Safety, DDA, risk assessments, training needs, provision of adequate facilities! It will never get off the ground.

I cannot see it being long before there is a challenge under the human rights legislation from an organisation against the governments Facist policies of singling out the most vulnerable members of society as they are doing now. If they were stopping benefits for a certain ethic minorty who are allowed to claim duplicate benefits there would be an outcry from people like Liberty.

Trialia

Brassedoff, it has absolutely nothing to do with self-pity, but believe what you like. After all, you will anyway, and it's a waste of my time and energy to try to persuade or convince you otherwise.

My point was that they can't actually "get all the 18-25 year olds into work", for obvious reasons. And yes, I'm aware you were generalising, and it was a bad subject on which to do that. But for what it's worth, people closer to your age are much more likely to be employed, if you look at the statistics, because employers look for experience and if you don't have any, it's pretty hard to get it if you can't afford to work for free.

jamespir

Paul33 wrote: »

Those lay about teenagers should be forced into the Army or do litter picking etc.
The disabled should be left alone.I only registed yesterday and I find some of you fekin Twisted!

well if you dont like it leave and not all teens are layabouts

Gemstar30

mandyboops1973 wrote: »

The problem with the current goverment is their intrestes are always finacial they treat the country like its one big buisness but the uk is't a business if the objective is to take away from the shareholders ie the public. No business purposely sacrifices shareholder interest on such a huge scale, so its a bit of a backward philosophy imo. The reason for this is simple... the Tory objective is not the public, but enterprise.

I think you are wrong there!!
The only way to sort this country out IS to treat it as a business.

No one would accept a buisness is good if all it ever does is make losses.

Cut costs, improve turnover = a more profitable and secure country