The Public Sector Cuts - Anyone worried?

Money_Grabber13579

In my opinion, joining a union will only result in one thing - you being told to strike. And if you do that, you may as well go and ask for redundancy. Maybe the unions will learn that it's an employers market at the moment someday...For every member of staff that causes trouble, there's any pile more that will replace them. Hence why unions recommending strikes all over the place is a very foolish thing to do - it will mark your card.

x12yhp

It is heartening to see so many people who view the unions this way.

The cuts are hard and people will suffer but few deny that something needs done. The unions are in a mess of a position. We cannot hope for them to stand back and say nothing (they are there to protect the members, after all). We can only hope that they take a broader view of the situation, hope that they appreciate that there is no way they can save everyone and focus on getting the best out of a bad situation. I fear that those in charge fail to see the bigger picture and are deluded by their, supposed, power.

one2escape

Just remember unions are only as strong as the members in them.

steveymp

one2escape wrote: »

Just remember unions are only as strong as the members in them.

And are only as useless as the staff employed by them;)

My local rep is actually very good, he is unpaid by NIPSA, he is an ordinary worker just like us:T when you get to the employed officials you may as well talk to the wall, they can TALK THE TALK, but they don't WALK THE WALK. Oh and complaining about them does you no good either, I know because I've tried:o

x12yhp

one2escape wrote: »

Just remember unions are only as strong as the members in them.

I try not to think things like this; it does not provide a happy representation of said workforce!!

bingo_bango

Money_Grabber13579 wrote: »

In my opinion, joining a union will only result in one thing - you being told to strike. And if you do that, you may as well go and ask for redundancy. Maybe the unions will learn that it's an employers market at the moment someday...For every member of staff that causes trouble, there's any pile more that will replace them. Hence why unions recommending strikes all over the place is a very foolish thing to do - it will mark your card.

What? Claptrap of the highest order!

The Equal Opportunities Act means that you can't be discriminated against because of affiliation to a trade union. Ergo, you cannot then be discriminated against for exercising a legal right to take strike action. If you really think that departments will go against this basic employment right, then you do not understand just how NICS works.

As for the first line in your statement, I take it that you have been lucky enough not to require union representation in your working life.

I therefore salute you on all of the individual pay negotiations you have undertaken, all of the individual pension negotiations you have undertaken, and your fight to ensure that you have the right to have some of the best employment terms in the UK.

And just to clarify, the union does not take the decision to strike, it merely suggests it. It then ballots it's members on strike action and if a majority agree, they will organise the strike on behalf of members.

leftieM

Ah, bingobango, a refreshing voice amongst all the usual rubbish on here. Joining a union is a no-brainer. A fair employer has nothing to fear from a trade union.

x12yhp

If I was a good, hard working public sector worker, I would be putting my head down and doing my best to be noticed for doing a good job instead of putting my head up and being awkward. Discrimination laws are great things but you could be sacked for that inappropriate email you sent... you try proving it otherwise! In hard times I would rather not risk it...

bingo_bango

x12yhp wrote: »

If I was a good, hard working public sector worker, I would be putting my head down and doing my best to be noticed for doing a good job instead of putting my head up and being awkward. Discrimination laws are great things but you could be sacked for that inappropriate email you sent... you try proving it otherwise! In hard times I would rather not risk it...

I wouldn't risk it at any point, never mind in hard times. If I want to send inappropriate emails I wait until I get home

Discrimination legislation is there to provide a level playing field, not a bluffer's charter. The flip side to that is that everyone is subject to the same threat of redundancy, regardless of how much work they put in. Kind of takes away the incentive to do more than is needed to get the job done, and has the effect of demoralising everyone. Even those who are good at their job.

I'm certainly not excusing those who don't perform. In fact, if I had my way I'd have a mass cull of the incompetent, and promotion for those who know what they are doing. But I have to defend the majority of my colleagues as hardworking and competent.
Despite the bashing given daily in the media, not all civil servants view the job as a gravy train where they can put in the hours without putting in the effort. Many are performing well in underpaid, under resourced menial jobs. Why? Because they are painfully aware that just having a job is a big thing in the current economic climate.

Now that doesn't mean that they can't expect the same attitude from their employer. Contrary to what money_grabber and a number of others appear to believe, the whole point of a union is to ensure that there is a fair and cordial relationship between the employer and their staff. That does NOT mean bullying the employer until they cave in. It entails a huge amount of negotiation by unions on behalf of their members to prevent their rights from being eroded to the point of slave labour. But it's negotiation, not threats and demands. And it is always realistic in it's expectations.

If people want to believe the media and their sensationalism about civil servants and their unions, then that is up to them, but they should at least ask the questions about what actually goes on before slating them.

To those who feel they are in a position to criticise the unions. Come armed with facts and we can discuss the shortcomings of NIPSA or unions in general, but don't come in and repeat the same tired old headlines from sources who don't know where to find the real stories. It serves only the Government's attempts to play down the crisis, and gives some very good people a very bad name.

steveymp

bingo_bango wrote: »

To those who feel they are in a position to criticise the unions. Come armed with facts and we can discuss the shortcomings of NIPSA or unions in general, but don't come in and repeat the same tired old headlines from sources who don't know where to find the real stories. It serves only the Government's attempts to play down the crisis, and gives some very good people a very bad name.

I have numerous personal examples of Union ineffectiveness starting with the Unite union who I ended up leaving after they ignored any correspondence I had with them over the period of 1 year, I eventually got a response and apology from the General Secretary after I had left them.

I moved on to NIPSA on the recommendation of a friend at work who is a local unpaid rep for them. He is very good and tries very hard for all his local members, but even he admits he is fighting a losing battle when he flags problems further up the line:o My previous full time seconded NIPSA rep met with me 2 years ago and then sat on all my information for over a year before returning to his original post having done nothing for my case and eventually refusing to even take phone calls from me. My friend complained on my and others behalf at a regional meeting and received an apology on our behalf:o The replacement full time rep is trying but has explained that he found over 2 years of unanswered, unlooked at work shoved in a filing cabinet at the local office:o

Before you climb back on the high horse bingo, I know that regionally and nationally, unions are at the forefront of negotiations for pay and conditions and they do some good work for us there. However on a personal and local front they have been as useful as a chocolate tea pot for myself and lots of other people who work in the same area with me. I do not "repeat the same tired old headlines from sources who don't know where to find the real stories." I speak from the personal experience of myself and work colleagues.