The Public Sector Cuts - Anyone worried?

A.L.D.A

It would seem to me there are two issues relating to pensions. The first would seem to me like a breach of contract. How else can it be portrayed?

That it cannot be afforded is a separate issue. To pay would require the printing of money, the cost of borrowing would increase and the value of Sterling would decline. It would cause inflation and I suppose that would have some very real impact on the value of many pensions.

All money put into any pension schemes should be kept separate from other monies.

I have serious doubts about the wisdom of saving solely for your pension for many it assumes that the next 30 -40 years are going to be economically stable, and that I doubt. The value of savings are likely to be eroded by inflation. Better to encourage people to invest generally themselves in self managed schemes that they can invest and which accrue tax advantages.

I do like how those in the Private & Public sector somehow see the other as either better off or work-shy. I have worked in both and in both there are people who work hard, but in the Private sector those that don't are generally replaced. As for wages there are good and poorly paid in both sectors. Some of the easiest and best paid jobs are in management, or higher levels, in both sectors! Stacking shelves in a super market or being a hospital porter or clerk anywhere does not pay well.

In the end someone on a low salary is not going to have a good pension. I would rather that more attention was paid to the state pension, and all of us taking proper responsibility for our collective elderly.

The more I think about this, and similar, the more I realise that overall Government spending has been poorly managed. Obligations made that cannot be kept, systems set up that cannot be afforded, rules and regulations that add cost and little benefit, monitoring for the ability to show that you are ......................!!!! It is madness, it is straight from the Republic of Ruritania. Before we know it we will have guards parading about in bright uniforms and strange head gear! Colourful military pageants always seem to go hand in hand with a country in decline.

donkeyDragon

saverbuyer wrote: »

No it's pretty simple really.

10 people in the private sector get paid 1000 and puts x in a pot say 100 through tax.

total pot 1000

1 person in the public sector gets paid 1000 from the pot and pays 100 in tax.

Total pot size now 100.

Not 1000

Of Course Public Sector workers are exempt from Vehicle Excise Duty, VAT, Rates etc and all their salary is used to buy goods in specially set-up Public Sector shops so that none of the money can return to the Private Sector..........

saverbuyer

donkeyDragon wrote: »

Of Course Public Sector workers are exempt from Vehicle Excise Duty, VAT, Rates etc and all their salary is used to buy goods in specially set-up Public Sector shops so that none of the money can return to the Private Sector..........

The only section of society that can CREATE wealth is the private sector. Why is this so hard to understand?

We don't get richer employing public sector workers. We get richer exporting things we can sell to others.

All the things you listed the public sector workers paid for from taxes COLLECTED FROM THE PRIVATE SECTOR.

The government doesn't just magic the money from thin air you know. (well unless they employ QE or borrow the money). We get the money from selling things to others.

nowakee

For everyone being paid in the public sector there have to be several tax payers in the private sector. So I am rather glad that the UK is cutting back the public sector, unlike our equally indebted friends in Greece who thought that one in four in the public sector was a good idea.

donkeyDragon

saverbuyer wrote: »

The only section of society that can CREATE wealth is the private sector. Why is this so hard to understand?

We don't get richer employing public sector workers. We get richer exporting things we can sell to others.

All the things you listed the public sector workers paid for from taxes COLLECTED FROM THE PRIVATE SECTOR.

The government doesn't just magic the money from thin air you know. (well unless they employ QE or borrow the money). We get the money from selling things to others.

Thats all fine, but its only a small part of the bigger picture, what happens to the Private Sector(local small business) when all these people who used to work in the Public Sector are suddenly being paid benefits instead of a salary.(Yes, the Government will have more money but what are the chances of it being invested in UK, more likely it will be sent abroad, fund a new war, or keep some more wealthy bankers in a job)

Im sure the answer will be be that they will all fill vacancies in the Private Sector, but anyone living in the real world will realise that this is just not happening.

I work in the Public Sector my wife is Private (small business) and I can tell you things are tough (no money in local economy, no jobs, no job prospects). I just dont think the answer is piling more people on the jobless pile just so some people can feel better about how their taxes are distributed.....

A.L.D.A

saverbuyer wrote: »

The only section of society that can CREATE wealth is the private sector. Why is this so hard to understand?

I agree with where you are heading, but that statement is not strictly correct for it depends on how you define wealth. Am I wealthier for having my children go to school, or my ageing parent cared for? Are these services not part of our collective wealth? They have value as does clean streets and roads without pot holes.

The problem arises, because we as a Nation, are producing less goods than we consume and better than that we have a government that is funded on borrowing. So if we employ more Civil servants, whose services do not contribute to either reducing imports, or increasing exports, part of the money that is paying for them is funded by increasing National debt. Each Civil Servant employed will certainly help increasing money transactions in our economy, but as this is funded by debt it is a problem and their purchases, like everyone else, are in part helping to suck in imports, but in their case without increasing export capability.

There are many private sector businesses that are not funded by direct Government borrowing, that add to our internal wealth, but who generally do not earn revenue outside this country.

The priority needs to be to correct the trade deficit and get the governments spending back in line with what it raises in tax. Easy to say.

I think getting growth in wealth producing sectors is the priority. Costs, tax liabilities, complying with various legislation are alas all factors in overall economic competitiveness. We need to be a lot cleverer with our overall tax structures so that wealth creation is encouraged and sectors that import discouraged.

one2escape

A lot has been talked about the public sector pension but one fact keeps on not being picked up on. The short term the cost of the public sector pension as a % will increase but in the medium / longer term it is going to come down below what is now and thats if they keep it as is.

NAR

What an insulting statement from Government "Don't go on strike but have a 15 minute protest and save a day's pay."
If ever there was an incentive to strike this is it!! :mad: :mad:

Johnnypanic_2

As a public sector worker, for over 25 years, I have seen various "schemes" come and go, all aimed at making the public sector more efficent and more cost effective. Problem is, without fail, they have all supposedly saved money, but at the expense of the service, not by improvements. Recent cuts in the NHS have seen more and more pressure being put on the ordinary workers, because that's were these cuts really effect staff, not the higher end of management.

Is the private sector going to save the NHS, of course not, because if we rely on a system of profit first, we are heading towards the nightmare that is healthcare in the USA.

By all means, bring about effective change, but don't crucify the average public sector worker, who does a good job and deserves a bit of respect.

wouldbeqaulitymoneysaver

*scary stuff* ConDEM policy is aimed at dismantling the Public Sector cos it's bad, and getting so called efficient Private Sector to do it instead. It is ideological nightmare which is making us all poorer by loading us with increased costs, from private health insurance to private dentistry etc.