Venture photography

crane966

Venture are very expensive, they pull you in with what you think is a cracking offer then you get the hard sell for crazy print prices, their mark-up must be phenomenal !
You should look around for other smaller photographers such as Photo Studio at Home in Coventry, they come to you and print prices start at £8.50 for an 8"x10" print, fantastic value, they show some good comments from previous customers too.

portlandstone

Has anyone just paid for a few prints and then had them blown up and framed by someone cheaper...even a DIY job?

Mark_Payne

portlandstone wrote: »

Has anyone just paid for a few prints and then had them blown up and framed by someone cheaper...even a DIY job?

That would be copyright theft. [FONT=&quot]The 1988 Copyright Design and Patents Act section 77 & 80 assigns the copyright of the photographs taken to the photographer. It is contrary to the Act and an offence to copy or allow to be copied, the photographs covered by this contract by any means.

Whilst as a photographer I can't stand the Venture "double glazing / Timeshzre" sales technique, this would be poor form for a couple of reasons.

1. Theft is theft and two wrongs don't make a right.
2. Blowing up a smaller print to a large format image never looks right (will look "soft"). I always work form the original files and prepare the image to print at the correct size.

I do a hi-key sitting in your home for £65 and this includes a complimentary 8x10" print. I don't use any high pressure sales techniques and people always seem to buy more than one pose at £20 each and if they don't my costs are covered anyway.

Venture has done more to damage the reputation of professional photographers in this country than any other company ever. £800 for an 8x10" photo is wholly unjustified and they should be ashamed.

Mark

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Siemo

modgit wrote: »

today they were in our local shopping centre, and were offering the whole "experience" plus a FREE!!!! 5 x 7" reprint for £25.

I have family members who did this - ended up signing up for £1500 worth of (admittedly lovely) photos on a finance deal which they are still paying off (and they really can't afford it).

I think when we've had all the children we're going to have it would be nice to have a venture-style photo done but I wouldn't go there because of the cost and because the pics are so lovely I would inevitably end up spending hundreds...

Big_Saver_4

I was given £25 voucher for venture photography from a friend that said she wasn't going to get around to using it .. great I thought, how kind!

I thought it would be a brilliant idea to have some photos done of the kids for gifts for the grandparents and also to maybe get a canvas done for my kitchen.

The photos were really great and it was really fun but I nearly had a heart attack when they sat me down during the viewing and started to discuss prices I explained that it was really out of my budget and would only be opting for the little one but she then started going on about payment plans and spreading the cost as a single mother I really didn't think this was a good idea and came away feeling rather cheated! and no pictures for the grandparents

I was recommended by a lady at work to look go to Silvestri Studios, she had been to them and thought her pictures were great. I did and had a great time and it was about half the cost for really similiar pictures. Was very impressed

Studio_Owner

As a past studio owner of a Venture Franchise I guess I am fairly well qualified to cover a few of the issues raised here.

Firstly, as a caveat the majority of studios are independently owned (hence they ARE local businesses supporting their local areas) being independent, the standards vary between them but the vast majority are owned by Photographers who previously operated independently from the brand. I spent 17 years running my own studio before seeing the benefits of the Venture Model and buying into it, and working with them for a further 8 years.

In my experience the vast majority of studios provide exceptional levels of photographic quality. Part of the Franchise agreement (and the assumption here is that any studio in question is maintaining its Franchise obligations) is that all working photographers must be fully qualified (to degree level) So minimum 3-4 years.

They then undergo a further 18 month in house programme to validate and expand their knowledge.

They produce stunning pieces or work, day in day out and are passionate about it. They also have exceptional people skills, they can draw the fleeting moment out of the most obtuse teenager or tempered two year old which is literally captured forever.

To claim that anyone with a decent level of equipment can replicate this is uneducated, verging on ignorant. Chimpanzees may well one day create shakespeare ... but I sure wouldn't want to be paying for the privilege of watching them practice.

The products themselves (frames / blocks etc) are manufactured within its own facilities in Knutsford exclusively for its Franchised members. So it is all UK made, not some cheap imported variant. All frames are hand assembled, packaged and boxed by them, again employing and supporting the UK economy.

All prints are done on Durst Theta LED printers. These use a light sensitive Kodak paper to develop an image. This is a completely different, and in my professional opinion superior technology than the majority of Inkjet / Giglee printers most photographers currently rely on. The cost of each of those printers ... ouch !

This is the case for all of the products, from the 5x7 complementary images through to the largest gallery frames. Being produced in house the "innovative" ranges remain unique to Venture, and it was always amusing each year to see other frame suppliers scrabbling around in May to copy what Venture had launched in its annual product update the previous month ... and never quite succeeding.

The benefits, its a controlled supply line. There is no reliance on a third party who may be cutting corners, or not here this time next year. If a lower cost photographer provides a product, and 12 months down the line its faded or failing what recourse would you have? Is that Photographer going to be willing, or able to stand by his / her product as per the Consumer Guarantees Act ?

If someone is selling a 10 x 8 framed image for £40 I'd question both the archival quality of the print, and the frame components, including the UV properties of the glass (assuming its not Plexiglass ... which simply bakes out the print solvents at an accelerated rate).

Loxleys as an example, who are a very reputable Framing company charge a minimum £30 +vat for their 10x8 frames not including glass ?

You would be needing a fair few thousand sales each year to sustain that business model ...

When it comes to cost, yes Venture products are expensive.

They also in general operate studios within Central City Locations, 7 days a week, late into the evenings and employ large numbers of people all to provide the best level of service possible.

Being larger companies they are subject not only to VAT, but also must carry large insurance policies for public liability, rentals, wage bills, equipment costs and similar which the majority of smaller photographers avoid. My age old adage that cutting costs cuts service levels !

Venture have always employed the doctrine of less is more, avoiding the machine gun approach of "heres 100 images on a disk / prints go do what you like with them" Instead, from each session the goal is to provide 3-5 stunningly finished items to display within the home. Built to the highest quality so they will last as any investment should.

It is claimed as art work, and should be appreciated as such. I personally don't look at a watercolour and wonder how much the paper cost nor do I really care. I look at what the artist has created. Why are so many detractors claiming to be photographers yet basing everything on the cost of the raw materials, and not on their own talent and time?

To revisit an earlier example, if I covered a wedding for the day I'll charge £1500 depending on location. The client will receive a Queensbury or Graphire album which cost me £225 +VAT to purchase. This is very much a typical package for the majority of full time wedding photographers. 82% mark up ... how does that equate to those same detractors.

From a financial perspective my own studios business plan was always built around an after tax 4% profit margin which is incredibly low given the costs involved. Mark up on the product was approx 70% which again is incredibly low given typical retail models which do not have the added cost of the photographic element (see above example for similar products).

The Franchise element itself was negligible given the offset in marketing visibility provided. While still a factor it certainly didn't equate to any significant increase in cost (and there certainly weren't any "fat cats in helicopters" reaping the rewards behind the scenes).

I do take umbrage to people using terms like "thieving b****ards" when they talk about me and my business.

Like any industry or business it relies on individuals, and everyone has a bad day occasionally, or doesn't represent the business as it should. Its up to the business to rectify those "bad days", and go out of its way to provide outstanding customer service.

Further their seems to be an element of accusation for providing payment plans to clients. This puzzles me as like any large purchase the ability to spread the cost makes items affordable. I doubt many of us would own houses, drive cars or even have mobile phones if this facility didn't exist?

All studios hold Credit licences, and act as an introduction service to both the Lloyds TSB and Hitachi Capital Finance whose role it is to determine if the client meets lending criteria. Thats part of the responsible lending legislation that all businesses must adhere to. I wonder if the same accusations are made against those that use credit cards to make purchases?

I do admit it does disappoint me when I read of some of the poor service some employees have provided in the past. Forum members should be naming the Studio involved so they can be judged on its on merits and praising those that do provide good service so they can be rewarded for their performance.

My advice, go to your local studio, ask to see examples of THEIR work, every studio enters an Awards process annually and the best work is selected for the Brand to use. Having a strong presence in this will indicate a photographically strong studio. Meet the staff, the photographers, the owners and the managers just as you would any other photographers. Judge them on this basis.

Go in with an open mind, prepare to be caught up in the emotion of it all but also take responsibility for your own spending ... seriously!

The Venture Product is not for everyone, don't expect it to tick all the boxes (I remember reading a complaint from a scrap-booker that wanted all the prints so she could cut them up for her own use and was vocally abusive that Venture did not provide a suitable product for this for less than £100) Its about education, read up on what products are on offer, ask your local studio, look at the website, go and look at the products in person.

And finally, given that its had on average 60 studios operating internationally for 10 years now, with i'd estimate 1000 families through each studio annually thats some 600,000 photographic sessions shot ... so theres got to be the majority that are delighted with what they received from the experience, I take some solace from that fact.

And finally, why did I sell my business? Because the realisation came that the industry as a whole is being undermined by the lowest price point ideal. I know what it costs to run a photography business LONG TERM both within a franchise and independently and "professional photographers" that spend their weeks working in an office, and their weekends ruining weddings for £500 a go was enough for me to look elsewhere for a living.

grintricha

shop around, spend time searching the internet and you can find good local photographers for reasonable money

we spent £250 for basically a few hours of a photographers time (1 hour to shoot and another hour he spent colour touching a few + travel) and got 50 hi res digital shots from the shoot. I don't know if I'm allowed to advertise the chap we used in surrey but he was fab.

Since then we've printed off far too many of them and I can't help myself but each time there's a free photobook offer I get one

Richard

bounderboy

Studio Owner thanks for your long reply. I have to disagree with you and I am sure my experience was atypical for venture.

The "experience" is not value for money at all . the quality is ok - but what you fail to mention at all is the Emotional Blackmail implied or otherwise of seeing pictures of your family that you can never own be paraded in front of you and never be seen again.

Each photo is a little slice of time from your families life that are then binned deleted for ever - yes you can buy one for over a 1000pounds or you can buy a memory stick for £750 with 8 prints on it - that can only be looked at on a windows pcs and cannot be shared with anyone else..

Its making my blood boil now knowing there are smiles and experiences of my children sitting on a hard drive somewhere that I will never see again... to be deleted by someone in due course..

Studio_Owner

Re Bounderboy / Mark Payne.

I've just phoned my local Venture store, as maybe everyone should before quoting prices (and pointing the "finger of shame").

A Desk style 10" x 8" FRAMED image is £245, while a wall version with mount is £445. With the current promotion they are running, three 10" x 8" framed wall products can be had for £890 and the store in question had a "Desk Bundle" of three of the 10" x 8" frames for £495. The Digital product alluded to in bounderboys' post was offered for £395 with 10 images, but the studio in question actually recommended taking it as a "mini- album" instead (which was the same price) due to the problems non windows based systems have with the software used (They were completely up front about this from the outset).

The Digital version can be shared and does come with a lower resolution version on the USB stick in order to email or upload to social sites.

You may wish to contact your local studio and ask about current promotions for past clients.

Not as cheap as some competitors maybe but then you get what you pay for. I can fully sympathise with the frustrations of not being able to justify having everything (worsened xx-fold by the emotional element involved), but at the end of the day it is a business like any other and have to protect their price points.

And Mark, to put it bluntly if the "in-home portrait" images you have on your website are an indication of your standard of work, its a good illustration of what £65 gets you by comparison and I wish you luck in your marketing strategy.

tod123

I thought Venture had gone bankrupt by all the studios that closed down. Knew the guy who had a couple in my area , owns a very nice Ferrari.

The biggest problem Venture always had was it was easy for other photographers to get within 10-20 % of a venture style image and product , and charge 30% of a venture price. Even the nursery school Togs started doing kids on high key BG's bouncing on space hoppers

Other problem is, that high key look is old hat now , almost as unfashionable as a wicker chair on a brown background with a plastic plant. People want quality portraits again , like photo noir, not photoshop driven junk.