Michelin vs bridgestone

bigjl

bigjl wrote: »

But as far as lateral grip goes they are far from the best, after driving my Mondeo for 5 months with the Pirellis, I changed the fronts for Toyo Proxes, I could feel that the rear felt loose immediately in the wet,....................

When I changed the rear tyres for Toyos the handling was hugely improved at the rear, and cornering was more prgressive and surefooted.

I fully accept that not all drivers have the same skill levels, but I think my viewpoint is relevant as I have previously raced cars and I am also an Advanced Driver. And drive above the speed limits and down the wrong side of the road on a daily basis.

The above is a quote showing exactly what I said, not that I lost control or nearly crashed, but that i could feel the back was loose, this basically shows your argument and viewpoint to be unimportant as you have based your opinion on something that didn't excist and wasn't posted.

Actually you are "bigging" yourself up, you are not in the same position as me, you don't have the same training as me, you don't have the same abilities as me or the same level of relevant experience.

But you are in a position where you haven't crashed, is that due to your abilities or the abilities of those around you to avoid you.

Remember that you where proud of the fact that you only lost the back end of a BMW 2002 once, as this is a car had a backend that was well known to be a bit wayward, even as slow speeds it does show that you don't drive that fast.

Remember that sliding the back end of a car or van doesn't show a lack of driver skill, spinning one does, I didn't initially give it the "bigun", but you where the one that said driving down the road on the wrong side and exceeding spedd limits showed that I wasn't a good example of an advanced driver, I didn't say that. The main reason I didn't was because I didn't intend to make a big thing about my driving abilities.

But now that you come to mention it, I am probably in the top 5-10% in the UK, does that make you feel any better, the fact that I can driver faster and in a more controlled manner than the majority of the population doesn't mean that much to me normally, but when it comes down to driving ability and tyre choice that I have direct experience of then my opinion, and the opinion of all other people with my kind of training and experience. Must always be considered to be an "expert" opinion.

The tyres are not unsafe, but they are crap in the wet. And in my opinion they don't provide good value for money, especially as Toyo Proxes are slightly cheaper. This thread was about goodyear and bridgestone tyres, you never said anything when i mentioned that the Michelin was a better tyre, only when I disagreed with your recommedation did you throw your toys from the pram.

What does that really say about you?

I then showed why I thought my opinion was of relevance, you just think by doing something for longer makes you better, that is plainly wrong, or are you better at running than Usain Bolt as after all you have been running for about 30 years longer than him, albiet slowly and not as well.

If somebody by means of training and experience in any field has more knowledge than somebody without this knowledge and experience how do you describe the two kinds of people.

Personally I would describe them as "experts" and a "lay person".

By this defination then in this instance I could be considered an expert.

You state that you are accident free for 30 years, I am accident free for 21 years, I have admitted a fault accident when I was 19, have you been as honest.

But at 19 I didn't have the skills and training I now have, if I did I wouldn't have crashed back then would I?

skiddlydiddly

andygb wrote: »

This whole thing "kicked" off because Bigjl and others were showing off about THEIR driving skills, not me. It was in response to one post which I made, where I simply stated that I had used Pirelli P6000 tyres, and had found them to be good value, safe and durable.
Bigjl in particular wants to showcase his "professional" driving skills, whilst admitting that he could not control a Pirelli shod Mondeo in the wet. Other people have jumped on the bandwagon, to state that "everyone knows" that Pirelli tyres are lethal in the wet. I simply pointed out how long I had been driving for, and that apart from one spin a year after passing my test, I have been accident free. I do not do 50K miles a year (probably about 18K at the moment), and only around half of the miles are done on motorways.

I'm not particularly referring to you, just the thread in general and posts in other threads re the mileage.

bigjl

I will await the quote saying I lost control of a pirelli shod Mondeo with baited breath!

bigjl

Still no reply from Andy then?

andygb

bigjl wrote: »

after driving my Mondeo for 5 months with the Pirellis, I changed the fronts for Toyo Proxes, I could feel that the rear felt loose immediately in the wet,

I shall duly go to the back of the class Bigjl , you did say the rear felt loose immediately in the wet.
I am certainly not a slow driver by any standards, but I am no madman.
I can only repeat what I have experienced, and that is that Pirellis have been good enough for me on all occasions.
The worst tyres I ever experienced were Colway/Challenger remoulds on a BMW 528i. They were lethal in the wet, but seemed OK down the Mulsanne straight at around 145 MPH (Oh dear, How naughty of me:o). Mind you, the Michelin TRXs I replaced them with were not much better.