'What religion are you?' poll discussion

Conrad

adrian_clark wrote: »

punishment we all deserve for our lies, deceipt, idleness and greed.


:T

It is greedy to coveat Gods attention and a place in paradise. Far more greedy than that you can desire in a short mortal life.

A worthy God would want his children to explore the fullness of nature and unlock it's workings, he ceratinly would not respect beings that want simple answers.

elaine373

Muslim..................waits for the gasping of horror.:rotfl:

adrian_clark

stevemcol wrote: »

Wow, I can't believe this thread is still live. All very interesting views though.
Clearly our lives are very important to us as individuals. As a bigger picture, the earth and everything on it is effectively a pin !!!!! on the universe. Doesn't it all seem a bit trivial to have an all powerfull entity looking over it?
A bit like a lab experiment in a biology class.

I guess I'll just never understand the need for a god as an explanation for things.

What if we don't need a god but God is a real and He is sovereign over time, the Universe and all His creation? That we really are made in His image and likeness and He created us as an outpouring of His perfect Love, to reflect that love and He continues to love us beyond all measure and imagination. What if He really did send His Son, Jesus, on a rescue mission because we really are wicked from our mother's womb and He really did die on the Cross to pay the penalty for my sin and yours and conquered death displaying His power over His creation? Then that would make a difference wouldn't it?

The world wants you believe something different, the world wants you to depend on yourself, and its theories, religions and philosophies. The thing about lies is that they are attractive, or else we wouldn't believe them. You cannot love with lies; Love and Truth are dependant upon each other. Jesus said, "I am the Truth, the Life and the Way, nobody comes to the Father but through me". Now you can accept what the world says, that Jesus was a liar and deceiver and reject God, or you can accept who He said He was, " the Truth". A humble Galilean carpenter, around whom world history revolves, even with the least imagination that's got to be intriguing.

Ms_Magnetite

elaine373 wrote: »

Muslim..................waits for the gasping of horror.:rotfl:

Why would there be horror, Elaine?


(Said as an 'other'.)

Fifer

adrian_clark wrote: »

I agree. But people will make stuff that exists within that universe the sum and centre of their existence, their purpose for living, in other words an object of worship.

In what way is that worse than worshipping something that probably doesn't exist?

Soubrette

adrian_clark wrote: »

What if we don't need a god but God is a real and He is sovereign over time, the Universe and all His creation? That we really are made in His image and likeness and He created us as an outpouring of His perfect Love, to reflect that love and He continues to love us beyond all measure and imagination. What if He really did send His Son, Jesus, on a rescue mission because we really are wicked from our mother's womb and He really did die on the Cross to pay the penalty for my sin and yours and conquered death displaying His power over His creation? Then that would make a difference wouldn't it?

The world wants you believe something different, the world wants you to depend on yourself, and its theories, religions and philosophies. The thing about lies is that they are attractive, or else we wouldn't believe them. You cannot love with lies; Love and Truth are dependant upon each other. Jesus said, "I am the Truth, the Life and the Way, nobody comes to the Father but through me". Now you can accept what the world says, that Jesus was a liar and deceiver and reject God, or you can accept who He said He was, " the Truth". A humble Galilean carpenter, around whom world history revolves, even with the least imagination that's got to be intriguing.

The problem is that a universe without god appears to be pretty much the same as a universe where a god is postulated.

Two sets of people - one is christian (or any other religion) and one is atheist, en masse there is nothing that can show a difference between the two. Both groups of people have liars, thieves and murderers within them, conversely both groups of people have very honest, sincere people including heroes (people who sacrifice their lives for others).

They both suffer the same amount of illnesses, they both die at about the same age. There are some studies that show that spiritual people are happy than non spiritual or that social people are happy than non social - but once these difference are accounted for (atheists can be both spiritual and sociable and yet non religious) there is absolutely no discernable difference between these groups of people)

I would think, if there were a god, then he would look after his own in some way? That if there were some physical manifestation of something, that it would affect the world in some way?

stevemcol

adrian_clark wrote: »

What if we don't need a god but God is a real and He is sovereign over time, the Universe and all His creation? That we really are made in His image and likeness and He created us as an outpouring of His perfect Love, to reflect that love and He continues to love us beyond all measure and imagination. What if He really did send His Son, Jesus, on a rescue mission because we really are wicked from our mother's womb and He really did die on the Cross to pay the penalty for my sin and yours and conquered death displaying His power over His creation? Then that would make a difference wouldn't it?

The world wants you believe something different, the world wants you to depend on yourself, and its theories, religions and philosophies. The thing about lies is that they are attractive, or else we wouldn't believe them. You cannot love with lies; Love and Truth are dependant upon each other. Jesus said, "I am the Truth, the Life and the Way, nobody comes to the Father but through me". Now you can accept what the world says, that Jesus was a liar and deceiver and reject God, or you can accept who He said He was, " the Truth". A humble Galilean carpenter, around whom world history revolves, even with the least imagination that's got to be intriguing.

You see that is the problem when an atheist discusses religion with a believer. The atheist will generally present a reasonable argument which will then be countered with illogical rhetoric. Religion was 'invented' thousands of years ago because societies had few or no explanations for natural phenomena.

Fifer

adrian_clark wrote: »

A humble Galilean carpenter, around whom world history revolves

Except of course, it doesn't. Certainly not for non christians. And even for most christians, history did not start 2000 years ago.

TBagpuss

adrian_clark wrote: »

The world wants you believe something different, the world wants you to depend on yourself, and its theories, religions and philosophies. The thing about lies is that they are attractive, or else we wouldn't believe them. You cannot love with lies; Love and Truth are dependant upon each other. Jesus said, "I am the Truth, the Life and the Way, nobody comes to the Father but through me". Now you can accept what the world says, that Jesus was a liar and deceiver and reject God, or you can accept who He said He was, " the Truth". A humble Galilean carpenter, around whom world history revolves, even with the least imagination that's got to be intriguing.

Really? The "world" wants this? Which world are you referring to? Because it seems unlikly that the planet has formed a philosphical bview on the sbjct, and if by "the world" you mean "people who don't happen to share your religious viewpoint" then it seems rather arrogant to assume either that such a large number of people have a single view, and to try to assert you know what that view is.

I don't consider myself to be religious, but I don't think, or want to convince anyone else, that Jesus (if he in fact existed as a historical individual) was a liar or deciever - I am perfectly ready to accept that he may well have belived what he said. That does not make it true.

You also say

the world wants you to depend on yourself, and its theories, religions and philosophies

Theories, religions and philosphies such as Christianity, you mean?

I don't presume to speak for what anyone other than myself wants. I don't presume to 'want' for you to believe anything - I am content for you to believe whatever you wish. I just don't want to have YOUR beliefs, or those of the Pope, or of the Chief Rabbi, or my local Iman, or anyone else, foisted upon me.

Salaam

One for Mr Adrian Clarke to mull over.

A Muslim is someone who submits their will to God.

Jesus (pbuh) said "all of You who Submit your will to God, ARE MY TRUE Brothers and Sisters" (Mark 3:31-35).

(Matthew 7:21-23) "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles? Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'"

He said the will of my Father, not mine...

Quran 2:13: Say (O Muslims!): ' We believe in God, and the revelation given to us, and to Abraham, and Ishmael, and Isaac, and Jacob, and the Tribes, and that given to Moses and Jesus, and that given to (all) Prophets from their Lord; we make no distinction between any of them; and we bow to God (in ISLAM).

Jesus (peace be upon him) mentioned as PROPHET in the Bible:
Matthew 21:11; Luke 7:16 & Luke 24:19.