Free solar panel discussion

John_Pierpoint

Nukes are not much good for peak demand - you cannot turn them on and off like a water turbine or even a gas turbine.

You are suggesting that they are suitable for base load but even that is debatable.

Who was it who said "electricity to cheap to meter" as a justification for his bomb factory?:rotfl:

They'll certainly be infinitely better off with the Nukes than without them - have you ever read of the lifesytle in countires with an energy deficit/random powerouts/power for half an hour a day?

Yes I've lived in N.Cyprus - for people living a simple lifestyle it is almost fun living a 19th century life style for an hour or two a day. Would it be fun in the overcrowded unsustainable UK - no not much I remember the three day week and winter conditions.

When every home in this country is wrapped in a 10" insulation blanket I will agree that it is time to evaluate "nukes" as part of the energy mix.

Cardew

We have had this discussion before.

As stated in post #831 above, if Great Britain Ltd has a peak time electricity requirement of say 70 gigawatts((GW) we need generating capacity to meet that demand. Given solar produces nothing at night and wind nothing when the wind ain't blowing, that capacity has to be provided by fossil/nuclear power stations.

The pro/anti Nuclear debate will rumble on for ever, meanwhile we are lucky that France helps us out at times of shortage with electricity via the interconnector from their nice clean Nuclear powered power stations.

John_Pierpoint

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/9521db40-bc71-11df-a42b-00144feab49a.html

You might need to register to read this link - lots of talk about late overpriced and persecuted by the safety regulator.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_accidents_by_country#Overview

As well as importing French electricity, the prevailing wind from the channel reactors that produced it also heads in our direction.

So far there has only been one accident that has killed thousands so the industry stacks up quite well compared with say the results of the automotive industry.

Jon_Tiffany

Pincher wrote: »

If what you say is covered by the scheme, then why does Isis do it the hard way round, by recruiting roofs up and down the country, and putting up cash upfront? All they have to do is to lease a waste land for 25 years, which is paid for by rent over those 25 years, so not much upfront capital. Get people to stump up £8k cash, which they use to erect PV panels. Split the annual FIT £500, £1,000 like I said, and they are awash in cash flow, without very much initial capital at all. Obviously there is land rental, maintenance and overheads, so I don't think £500 is extortionate.

After loan interest and capital repayment, each householder still gets a good wack, just for signing a contract. No scaffodling, no planning permission, just free money. So EVERYBODY will sign up for it. How is it going to be paid for? Only homeless people without an address will not be getting the FIT!

The way FIT is funded, you need a thousand mugs to pay for one lucky sod. If you make it possible for everybody to get the FIT, nobody will get a penny. If the average bill is £1,200 now, you will end up paying £2,700 a year, and get £1,500 back in FIT. :rotfl:

They are putting PV panels up in the most piecemeal, leat cost effective manner possible, and letting commcerical companies leech away the community pot of money that we are forced to contribute to. Why don't they just take the money and build a solar farm! Arrrrgggh!

Sour grapes is somebody else getting something for nothing.
This situation is somebody puting their hand in my pocket: I call that stealing.:mad:

My guess would be that ISIS are not taking this approach because its not as simple as you may first think.

Lets suppose you actually manage to find some very low value land in the south of the UK. For it to be low value it will most likely be in a remote area. That means it probably will not have any connection to the grid. Sub stations cost a lot. Underground cables cost a lot. Planning permission is expensive and a nightmare, no doubt some local would object on grounds of it affecting the nesting grounds of the endangered lesser spotted warbling green tit.

This scheme is like many things in life. I pay my tax money, much of which is spent in things that I do not approve of.

And how much profit did british gas make this year? Why are the privately owned energy companies allowed to make aprofit at all? They have been stealing from us all for years. At least with the FITs, normal people like you and I have a chance getting involved.

John_Pierpoint

I get the impression that some of the UK electricity network is old and in need of refurbishment. There seems to be a shortage of 3 phase compared with some of our European neighbours.
I know of a community on the N.E. coast that was awarded funds to install heat pumps. Step one had to be the spending of a four figure sum per terraced house to improve the local electricity supply.

Cardew

Jon_Tiffany wrote: »

My guess would be that ISIS are not taking this approach because its not as simple as you may first think.

Lets suppose you actually manage to find some very low value land in the south of the UK. For it to be low value it will most likely be in a remote area. That means it probably will not have any connection to the grid. Sub stations cost a lot. Underground cables cost a lot. Planning permission is expensive and a nightmare, no doubt some local would object on grounds of it affecting the nesting grounds of the endangered lesser spotted warbling green tit.

This scheme is like many things in life. I pay my tax money, much of which is spent in things that I do not approve of.

And how much profit did british gas make this year? Why are the privately owned energy companies allowed to make aprofit at all? They have been stealing from us all for years. At least with the FITs, normal people like you and I have a chance getting involved.

As muted in previous posts, there are thousands of industrial/retail sites with huge flat roofed buildings - warehouses, factories, supermarkets etc in Southern UK where huge arrays of panels could be erected.

The reason they are not used is that they count as industrial large scale generated systems and attract a much lower level of subsidy. Instead we have huge numbers of panels mounted on thousands of roofs(with all the inefficiency that involves) so firms get get the high rate of subsidy - that we pay -. They have exploited a loophole in the regulations and are getting a subsidy meant for domestic users for an industrial scheme.

P.S. Lesser spotted warbling green tit? Presumably you meant the greater spotted warbling green tit? The 'lesser ain't endangered - there are flocks of the damn things!

Pincher

Jon_Tiffany wrote: »

This scheme is like many things in life. I pay my tax money, much of which is spent in things that I do not approve of.

And how much profit did british gas make this year? Why are the privately owned energy companies allowed to make aprofit at all? They have been stealing from us all for years. At least with the FITs, normal people like you and I have a chance getting involved.

British Gas does not get my business, because I have a choice.
I want to choose to not pay for somebody else's money spinning scheme, from which I am excluded. It's like banning English fisherman from fishing and then you ask them to pay for subsidised humane fishing nets for Spanish trawlers.

samba

John_Pierpoint wrote: »

So you feel perfectly happy about the Russians building a nuclear bomb raw material production unit in that democratic stable country Iran?

More FUD.

I know nothing about Iran apart from what the media feed me, and I suggest neither do you, so please stop with the scaremongering.

barneygumble

Can someone clarify who gets the money for the exported electricity if you take up one of these "free" offers?
My understanding is the installer takes the FIT and money for electricity generated. Parts of this thread seem to differ.

Cardew

barneygumble wrote: »

Can someone clarify who gets the money for the exported electricity if you take up one of these "free" offers?
My understanding is the installer takes the FIT and money for electricity generated. Parts of this thread seem to differ.

The firm that installs the system gets the FIT and the 3p/kWh for the exported electricity.

I believe ASG just elect for 50% of the generated electricity to be the assumed exported electricity; not sure about the other firms.

All the house owner get is what electricity they can use during the day from the generated electricity.