Free solar panel discussion

quoia

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the article on the front of today's Daily Express

http://www.dailyexpress.co.uk/posts/view/191224/Energy-1bn-solar-giveaway/

I've done a thorough search and can't seem to find any reference to it on these existing FREE Solar Panel threads (or anywhere else) - except the company is mentioned (albeit in passing) in this MSE article ...

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/utilities/free-solar-panels

BUT FROM TODAY - HOMESUN - are commencing the installation of 100,000 PV Solar systems

YES - ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND SYSTEMS over the next 3 years

https://www.homesun.com

Systems 3.5kW to 4kW

Llewod

The article says that energy must be used and cannot be stored. I'm sure I have seen photo voltaic systems that can be sent to a battery system for later use. If the solar companies get paid for the amount of electricity that your system puts back into the grid does that mean you cannot divert the excess electricity to a battery system. There is a case study on the energy trust website of a guy that is doing just that except this is from a wind turbine.

digitaltoast

quoia wrote: »

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the article on the front of today's Daily Express

http://www.dailyexpress.co.uk/posts/view/191224/Energy-1bn-solar-giveaway/

Well, if it's in the Daily Express, who am I to argue? Sign me up, I'll take two! Any news on Diana?

Jon_Tiffany

Llewod wrote: »

The article says that energy must be used and cannot be stored. I'm sure I have seen photo voltaic systems that can be sent to a battery system for later use. If the solar companies get paid for the amount of electricity that your system puts back into the grid does that mean you cannot divert the excess electricity to a battery system. There is a case study on the energy trust website of a guy that is doing just that except this is from a wind turbine.

Its technically quite easy to build a battery bank and store the electricity for use later on. Its more an issue of cost.

You would need a very large battery bank, plus charge controller and inverters. Plus there's a good chance that your batteries will need replacing in 5 years, or less if you discharge them too deeply. Off the top of my head lets say £600 for batteries, £200 for a good charge controller and £200 for a good pure sine wave inverter. So £1,000 outlay to save around £200 per year. Then in year 5 you need to fork out another £600 for new batteries.

beedydad

Gizmosmum and GeeBeeEl - Good observations you are right to think thru the actual costs of the kits and whether best to install for yourselves rather than someone else gaining the full benefits.

Yes a "green" loan supposedly coming along will be better as the theory is that the loan is repaid by the FIT which should easily match and thereby cost you nothing - role on that day.

Regards

mark333333

"Of course you can boil a kettle with a 2.2kw capacity panel if connected to the mains too, but then you can boil it with no panel when connected to the mains. Obviously, the point being made is that you can't boil a 2.2kw kettle purely from a 2.2kw capacity panel in the UK (maybe on the equator at midday you could, with a new panel, clean and correctly specced and installed etc etc."

of course you can it just takes longer to boil; thats why electric showers are quoted with different powers depending on your supply voltage. the shower still works on lower power but is not as hot .

quoia

andycopland wrote: »

.............................................

I also saved £65 on my electricity bill, which came from the electricity that I made and used directly, replacing units that I would previously have had to buy.

On top of that it turns out that I am in the lucky position of having an old meter which reverses and so I also saved a further £65 there too. I will of course lose this element when they update my meter to a smartmeter some time in the future.

.....................................................

Am I correct that the £65 saved on the bill is purely the difference in the 2 bills for 2009Q2 and 2010Q2 ?
So some of this could (I'm not saying it is) be as a result of a "MILD" Q2 in 2010 but a "rather harsher" Q2 in 2009 reflecting in some part a genuine reduced usage over this period this year ?

Is the further £65 due to meter reversal based on the fact that you saved £65 on your electricity bill AND derived from the concept that you actually USED only 50% of what you generated (as it was being generated) and thus the other 50% was "EXPORTED" sending the meter the wrong way ?

mark333333

Just like to update a previous post, my system has produced 85 kwh in one week sorry i forgot it was turned on last thursday not wednesday. further more i have been informed by Azure Eco that they will be fitting a free web box to the system sometime within the next few weeks so i can monitor its production over the web. If possible i will post the web address so anyone intrested can access the info it may be of use to them in making any future decisions on the subject. I Had a 4kwh system facing south on a 30deg roof with no shading. Sunny boy inverter and sharp pannels.

albyota

grahamc2003 wrote: »

My main point though is that there are people jumping on here who clearly do not have a scooby what is going on, and the danger is people might actually believe them.

QUOTE]

Well, yes, that was my point too. Ok, you think it's me talking crap, I think it's you. I look at the issue from the viewpoint of a National Grid professional engineer, and you as an owner who doesn't know the difference between energy and power.

The world is full of amazingly efficient generation technologies with amazing claims, especially when they are 'environmental'. Unfortunately, just like the Warwick wind study (which people may google if interested), many people effectively get duped by massively exagerated claims and totally unrealistic expectations, usually originated from PV sales staff and others with a financial interest.

Of course you can boil a kettle with a 2.2kw capacity panel if connected to the mains too, but then you can boil it with no panel when connected to the mains. Obviously, the point being made is that you can't boil a 2.2kw kettle purely from a 2.2kw capacity panel in the UK (maybe on the equator at midday you could, with a new panel, clean and correctly specced and installed etc etc).

So if this is from a professional National Grid Engineer.............No wonder the UK is in such a mess, the grid is going to fall over, If the national grid did their sums correctly and invested the huge profits into cleaner power stations....we would not be needed to clean it up with Solar PV.
with upto 5 or more power stations coming offline in the next 3 years and more to follow and replacements 10 years away.....someone need to be concerned.

quoia

mark333333 wrote: »

"Of course you can boil a kettle with a 2.2kw capacity panel if connected to the mains too, but then you can boil it with no panel when connected to the mains. Obviously, the point being made is that you can't boil a 2.2kw kettle purely from a 2.2kw capacity panel in the UK (maybe on the equator at midday you could, with a new panel, clean and correctly specced and installed etc etc."

of course you can it just takes longer to boil; thats why electric showers are quoted with different powers depending on your supply voltage. the shower still works on lower power but is not as hot .

You're missing the point, as are many over this "boiling a kettle" issue.

VOLTAGE is not the issue at all - it's TOTAL "INSTANT" POWER OUTPUT of the PV Solar array compared with the TOTAL "INSTANT" DEMAND.

REALTIME IN - REALTIME OUT - REALTIME EXCESSES - REALTIME SHORTFALLS

The meter spinning backwards whilst boiling a kettle is a red herring , or at least a confusion, and trying to explain it with a 2.2kW panel and a 2.2kW kettle probably doesn't help at all.

The ASG system is a 3.3kW array and as I understand it will only generate the full 3.3kW in a cloudless sky at midday on the equator when mounted perfectly horizontally so it is pointing directly at the sun.

Mounted on a south facing roof in England on a similar sunny day at noon it might generate 2.8kW.

Having established that - if you are generating 2.8kW and you've got a 1kW electric kettle then yes you can boil that kettle "direct" from the panels - you've got more power than you need (and quite possibly with little other consumption of fridge/freezer etc. then certain meters MAY spin in the wrong way because you are "exporting" the excess)

However if your kettle is 3kW (just like mine is) then when you switch it on you will ALWAYS need a top-up from the grid to enable it to boil - otherwise you'll be in an overload situation and either blow the inverter or a fuse, or the inverter etc. will shut-down to protect itself.
No meter will be running backwards in this situation since demand is exceeding the inverter output and you are "importing" electricity.

The "kettle is only on for a few minutes" so it uses a lot less than 3kW is meaningless.
Yes - it would have to be on for a full hour to use 3kWh (3 kW for an hour) and if it is only on for 6 minutes (tenth of a hour) then it only uses 0.3kWh.
Over that 1 hour period your panels might generate 2.8kWh which is WAY MORE than the kettle consumed during its 6 minutes, BUT when the kettle is ON you are definitely buying some (0.02kWh) electricity from EON or whoever.
When it is off (for the other 54 minutes) your panels are making the other 2.52kWh that you haven't used boiling said kettle - and unless your fridge/freezer etc. is using some of it then it will all be exported back to the grid.

Of course if your fridge/freezer etc. were in use and consumed power WHILST the kettle was having its 6 minute moment of glory then you would have bought even more (than the 0.02kWh) electricity from EON or whoever.