Dental Treatment Abroad

Teerah

Undisputedtruth wrote:

I agree with the cheapest option is to look after your teeth but there could be circumstances beyond your control on losing your teeth. For example losing a tooth through a fight, falling down on the ground, etc. I'm sure you're able to understand that. I've posted my comments about the cheapest option as this thread is about treatment in Hungary and not how to look after your teeth. I hope you understand that.

Undisputedtruth

Of course there may be circumstances beyond a persons control which may lead to tooth loss. As a dentist I fully understand that, but as a dentist I can assure you that this is not the most common means by which a tooth is lost. As this site is about moneysaving , I feel I am justified in saying that looking after teeth in the first place is the cheapest option. If teeth are lost in an accident of some sort, there will usually be compensation available which will pay for the treatment in the UK. Therefore other tooth loss which incurs large bills can be preventable. I hope you understand that.

Undisputedtruth

Toothsmith wrote:

So Irony can be added to the list of things lost on you UDB.

Along with

Evidence bases
Buisness economics
Sustainable development
Career development
Healthcare economics
Reasoned argument
The truth
..........................................

Toothsmith, you can use as many terms as you wish but they do not disguise greediness in my books.

Teerah wrote:

Of course there may be circumstances beyond a persons control which may lead to tooth loss. As a dentist I fully understand that, but as a dentist I can assure you that this is not the most common means by which a tooth is lost. As this site is about moneysaving , I feel I am justified in saying that looking after teeth in the first place is the cheapest option. If teeth are lost in an accident of some sort, there will usually be compensation available which will pay for the treatment in the UK. Therefore other tooth loss which incurs large bills can be preventable. I hope you understand that.

Yes I do understand and if you read my post properly you will find it covered the points you are making above. So I refer you to my earlier comments on this matter.

Undisputedtruth

Toothsmith

Undisputedtruth wrote:

Toothsmith, you can use as many terms as you wish but they do not disguise greediness in my books.

Undisputedtruth

Are your books nicely coloured in? Or aren't you allowed pointy things? :dance:

Teerah

Undisputedtruth wrote:

Yes I do understand and if you read my post properly you will find it covered the points you are making above. So I refer you to my earlier comments on this matter.

Undisputedtruth

If you had understood and agreed with what I had said there would have been no need for your earlier comment. Because you commented on what I had written, I assumed you did not understand why I had made the point on this thread so I felt it necessary to explain more fully so that I could clarify matters for you. I do not wish to drag this thread further off topic however with petty arguments so will not be dragged into this further. Thanks.

Undisputedtruth

Teerah wrote:

If you had understood and agreed with what I had said there would have been no need for your earlier comment. Because you commented on what I had written, I assumed you did not understand why I had made the point on this thread so I felt it necessary to explain more fully so that I could clarify matters for you. I do not wish to drag this thread further off topic however with petty arguments so will not be dragged into this further. Thanks.

As I said before the thread is about dentists in Hungary and other places. My comments were made in relation to this but your comments were completely incongruent to the whole thread. If you want to discuss the issue of preventative Dentistry then by all means start a new thread rather than dragging this thread further off topic. My advice to you would be to read my posts carefully and understand the essence of the thread to avoid future conflict. I hope this make sense to you. If not, please give me a shout and I'll give you a more simple explanation.

Undisputedtruth

Teerah

Hi undisputed truth, you do provide some light relief. However, please follow you own advice, ie carefully reading posts. I have clearly explained why I made the comment and you may continue to show your ignorance by choosing to ignore anything that you do not personally agree with. That is up to you. Your reply infers that travel to hungary and such places is mostly due to trauma and this is, of course, a nonsense and I think you realise that or you would not continue to ignore what I have said. I am not sure what you hope to achieve by continuing with this. And yes I have replied to this again but only so other readers may understand why I have posted previously (although it was self-explanatory). Regards, teerah

Toothsmith

Undisputedtruth wrote:

As I said before the thread is about dentists in Hungary and other places. My comments were made in relation to this but your comments were completely incongruent to the whole thread. If you want to discuss the issue of preventative Dentistry then by all means start a new thread rather than dragging this thread further off topic. My advice to you would be to read my posts carefully and understand the essence of the thread to avoid future conflict. I hope this make sense to you. If not, please give me a shout and I'll give you a more simple explanation.

Undisputedtruth

At last it seems to be sinking in with you that going to Hungary, or anywhere abroad for a major rebuild has nothing to do with preventative dentistry. It also seems to have got through to you from the earlier quote, below, that the cheapest option is to look after your teeth. This is best achieved by enrolling as a patient with a convenient dentist who subscribes to the principals of preventative dentistry - wherever in the world that may be.

Undisputedtruth wrote:

I agree with the cheapest option is to look after your teeth but there could be circumstances beyond your control on losing your teeth. For example losing a tooth through a fight, falling down on the ground, etc. I'm sure you're able to understand that. I've posted my comments about the cheapest option as this thread is about treatment in Hungary and not how to look after your teeth. I hope you understand that.

Undisputedtruth

The subject of preventative dentistry is absolutely key here though, it is not a side issue at all.

As I have said before, and seems to be backed up by Candyman67's silence now, the vast majority of people to whom this idea will appeal are those who have neglected their teeth for years and have built up a huge backlog of work.

A person with galloping gobrot getting a quote for (let's say) £20000 worth of cosmetic rebuilding, and then going abroad and getting it done for £3000 are not saving £17000. They are wasting £3000.

It is like putting lipstick on a pig! Difficult, expensive, fraught with danger, and ultimately pointless!

Unless the process that got them into that state in the first place is addressed, then nomatter how well the treatment is done, it will fail.

The principals of good treatment planning are the same the world over.

Get the patient out of pain
Remove anything that can't be saved.
Treat & stabilise the disease process.

This first bit should be ALL that happens in the first phase of treatment. During that phase, advice and education should enable the patient to understand why their mouth has got into that state, and how they can avoid it happening in the future.

Over the next few months to years, the situation should be maintained and stabilised.

ONLY when the patient has demonstrated a pattern of improved attendance, care and motivation should anything more advanced be undertaken.

Doing more advanced stuff on people who are not ready for it is not only going on abroad. It also happens in this country, and is even televised in such programs as '10 Years Younger'. At least in this country though, there is no excuse for the patient not to go regularly, and by paying a more realistic amount of money for the treatment, a patient is more likely to value it and look after it. (It still shouldn't happen though - in my opinion.)

saz9961, the OP does have a sensible attitude towards getting work done abroad, and appeared to understand the implications of it all. Provided nothing unexpected goes wrong during the treatment, which could get very expensive he could easily come out of it with some good dentistry. The more typical 'client' which these clinics target though, are types like Candyman67 and for them, it is completely inappropriate.

I am happy to keep this debate going on as long as UDB is willing to play the fool. Like the medieval jester, he does bring up some valid points and is not afraid to look completely stupid. The world needs his type.

candyman67

The reason for my silence was that I had said my bit, and it was for you to think about it and form your own opinion. That's the reason for forums like this.

The 10 year neglect of my teeth was indeed my fault, however, as a few are pointing out, a long term relationship with a dentist is for the better. However, having moved a few times in those 10 years, including a 60 mile relocation, long term was not an option.

The amount of fillings that I originally had was due to an over indulgence in my youth. The original (broken)crown was necessary due to an accident. The 2 crowns above were done at the same time. Same accident. They're still there and I'm happy.

It needs to be pointed out that when I had the emergency molar extraction, the dentist at that time, English by birth and English trained, had a look around my mouth, and with the exception of the rotten stump at the front, could find nothing else necessary.
Even the removal of the stump, which was a crown gone wrong, done by an English trained dentist, practising here, was not necessary. It just didn't look good, therefore it was cosmetic. I had the extraction, a polish and then away. That was just over £50 for 25 mins work.
REMEMBER, HE FOUND NOTHING ELSE WRONG, AND HE IS ON PIECE RATE!

As I didn't need the stump removed, the molar replaced, or more importantly any other fillings or work, I would say that those 10 years of not visiting the dentist were justified. Perhaps I was the lucky one, or maybe my routine got better. I still only brush once, at the end of the day, so the change must be diet.

The reason for deciding to get all the bridge work etc was purely for vanity / cosmetic reasons. What the heck, I'm late 30s so time to start preserving the looks. It's all downhill from here otherwise!

I figured if I'm going to go the cosmetic route, then I may as well go all the way. So I did a check with same dentist that did the extraction, and to replace the 7 metal fillings with white, remove the stump, do a 4 piece bridge for the front and a 5 piece for the left, would have cost in excess of £2500. Far too much just to maintain my stunning good looks. As you can read from my first postings. I was able to get all the work done for just over £1000 in Hungary. If you add the 3 flights (I did say I split it by choice) at £80 each, it brings it to about £1300. I could have had it done in one trip over a week, but I'm seeing somebody from there, so it gave me something to do while they were at work, and I just had a little done on each occasion.

My brushing regime has not changed, still once a day, with the occasional mouthwash or extra brush if I'm going out. The only thing that has differed is the further lowering of my sugar intake. But that has as much to do with health as it does with the maintenance of my teeth.

Another concern for some of our citizens is the fact that "Big Brother" has yet another way to keep tabs on us. How often do we here that a body could only be identified by dental records? Where are these records held? How did they know where to start? What is the legal obligation of our dentistry to update those records? Another reason, for some, to use a foreign service. I've screwed them up now with my new mouth!
Got any answers anyone?

Putting aside your strange past-time of trying to put make up on a pig (just how do you know how difficult it is?) Could I suggest that next time you take a visit to a foreign shore, and let's be honest, at your rates that must be at least 3 times a year, why not pop in to a clinic there. All it needs is just a check up or a polish, nothing serious, just so you can judge for yourself their professionalism.
I often assess other driver's skills and standards in the passenger industry, both here and abroad, against mine, just to make sure that I am delivering a high level of service to my clients. Come down from your celestial throne and join us mere mortals, if nothing else, you could then justify your position.

But with regards to the arrogent attitude of a previous poster that you should be able to charge 10 times the current amount.......... £500 to have a tooth pulled. That would have resulted in another set of teeth being broken.

Teerah

candyman67 wrote:

Another concern for some of our citizens is the fact that "Big Brother" has yet another way to keep tabs on us. How often do we here that a body could only be identified by dental records? Where are these records held? How did they know where to start? What is the legal obligation of our dentistry to update those records? Another reason, for some, to use a foreign service. I've screwed them up now with my new mouth!
Got any answers anyone?

These records are just the dental records held at dental practices, there is no national register. As far as knowing where to start, basically the body has already been given a possible identification, this is then confirmed or disproved by checking the dental records. It would be impossible to identify somebody solely from dental records without having other information to go on. Not really a reason to use a foreign service though unless you intend to be found at the bottom of a lake/in a fire/otherwise mutilated. (and yes I know your comment in relation to this was tongue in cheek)

Toothsmith

Thak you Candyman, for stepping back into the ring to confirm my suspicions.

I have seen some technically very bad crowns that have caused no problem whatsoever inside some patient's mouths. I have seen excellent crowns rot away into mush.

The difference? How the patients look after them.

Your 'Stump at the front' was caused by a 'crown that went wrong' because you didn't look after it properly. The edge of a crown is always a weak spot where decay can start off much more easily than on a healthy tooth. Had you been to a dentist more frequently, the initial decay might well have been spotted before it became a stump.

You don't explain why the molar had broken, but they don't just break for no reason.

What have you now had done?

Loads more crown units put on - which will have disturbed previously healthy teeth. Created a load more food traps around your mouth and sites for decay to start. Replaced perfectly good metal fillings with a material which is much more prone to get decay at it's edges. And you still are no wiser as to why it all went wrong in the first place.

And that's money well spent?

You will probably be fine for the next 5 years. Assuming the work is of high quality.

Unless something radical changes in your self-care though, and you actually start visiting a dentist for routine maintenance, all you have achieved is to bring forward the date you will need full dentures by about 20 years.

There's value for money.