Dental Treatment Abroad

Undisputedtruth

Toothsmith wrote:

Are you aware of the costs involved in becoming proficient in placing them UDB?

Hmmm, Toothsmith not able to justify the high cost of dental implant treatment.

Toothsmith wrote:

Do you realise the surgeons who do become proficient in bone grafting and techniques such as sinus lifts?

Hmmm, Toothsmith not able to justify the high cost of dental implant treatment again. No facts or figures.

Toothsmith wrote:

I'm sure you are far to informed to believe any old Thomas Richard or Henry can do it.

Do you have evidence that I think that any old Thomas Richard Henry or Toothsmith can do it? Let me answer this for you....NO, so carry on making up my mythical opinions.

Toothsmith wrote:

How much do you think an ordinary dentist like me would have to shell out before feeling confident enough to drill a bit of titanium into someones skull?

Correct, ordinary dentist feeling threatened by competition
from abroad.

Toothsmith wrote:

The costs are the same for the Eastern Bloc dentists, it's just their running costs are so much lower that they can recoup the costs of training more easily.

Apparently not. The cost of implants varies according to country.

Toothsmith wrote:

EDIT - just noticed, you quoted the cost price of just the implant, but the full price of implant + crown.

Toothsmith wrote:

Just the surgery bit to have the implant put in is about £1200.

Again, you're unable to justify the 1500% mark up.

Toothsmith wrote:

BTW do you know the cost of a breast shaped bag of saline by any chance? I bet there's a huge profit in that too!

Probably not as much as the mark up in dental implants.

Undisputedtruth

Toothsmith

candyman67 wrote:

Last year I went to Hungary, firstly for pleasure, but with the idea of going to the dentist tagged on.
Due to the fact that, other than an emergency extraction, I'd not seen a dentist for about 10 years, I expected a lot of work needed. So I booked in for a check up first.

I am glad you are happy with your teatment.

I am not against anyone going anywhere for dental treatment, it is your choice. I am merely pointing out the pitfalls that are not always mentioned in the press releases that advertise such treatments. These centre around continuity of care.

Now that you have your new smile, could you let me know how your behaviour and attitude towards you teeth has changed?

Has the treatment been reviewed by anybody, either where it was done or here? Has your diet changed in any way to protect your new smile? Do you now intend to make regular visits to a dentist (Anywhere) for regular check ups?

Toothsmith

Undisputedtruth wrote:

Again, you're unable to justify the 1500% mark up.


Undisputedtruth

This is so mind numbingly ignorant that it must be a wind up!

Of course I can't show you a 'price' for training - it's a career pathway. There is no one way of doing it. How can you quantify everything involved?

To be able to place implants in simple cases either a UK based course at one of the teaching hospitals, probably on a day release basis, usually once a month over a couple of years, would be necessary. Alternatively, one could go on a couple of week course in either Scandenavia or the U.S (Depending on which system the dentist chose to use). The cost of this would be in the 10s of thousands, plus the time off from the surgery, plus all the tools that go with placing the things, and an implant kit.

Also, if it is important to a surgeon that his implants last a decent length of time, a good working knowledge of occlusion and the forces involved is necessary. This is a different bunch of courses, although the better implant courses include this aspect.

Moving onto the more complex cases will require more time off from the day job to study the anatomy, and the surgical skills necessary for the operations I mentioned. Again, there are many ways to go about this, but none are cheap.

By the time somone becomes proficient case assessment, treatment planning, surgery and the prosthetic build up that follows, the best part of £150 000 could easily have been spent.

Inspiron_2

Well said Toothsmith, couldnt have put it better myself.

The amount of investment ( time and money ) it takes us to be well trained dental surgeons i think we should be able to charge 10x what we do.

I have been only out of uni for a few years and post grad education has cost me approx 50k if u also take into acc time off work.

Then people complain that we charge what we do for out skills !

A course of cancer supressent drug that has been in press recently costs under 5p per capsule. Yet drug companies are charging over £20,000 for a years supply. WHY ? Because of all the years it has taken to produce that drug ? Food for thought

Teerah

candyman67 wrote:

So, I had................................At conversion rate at that time

Panoramic Xray.....................................£12.78
Xray...................................................£4.30
Metal ceramic crowns 9 pieces................£572.50
Anesthetics 10 ampules.........................£17.37
Fillings MOD (replaced metal with white)....£251.81
Radix extraction (Remove a rotten stump).£21.39
Tooth cleaning, inc polish.......................£26.95
Temporary crowns................................£91.25
Filling occlusodist...(what was that?)........£36.67

A total of £1035.02
The standard was great. Professionalism fantastic, and I made the booking from England by phone without any introduction.

This was done over 3 occasions, by my choice.

How many fillings did you have replaced? Apart from your crowns the other treatment costs are on a par with NHS prices here. Thats a hell of a lot of work to have done in threee visits after not having been to a dentist for ten years! Must have been fun. As far as saying that the standard was great I'm afraid unless you have had this verified by another dental professional then this can only be assumed on your part. People usually judge their treatment on their experience of pain and how they were made to feel during treatment so unless something gos wrong, it is impossible for you to say whether or not the standard actually was great from a clinical point of view.

Undisputedtruth

Toothsmith wrote:

This is so mind numbingly ignorant that it must be a wind up!

If I was truly mind numingly ignorant then I would believe your over exagerated spiel.

Misrepresenting people's words and over exagerating comments without supplying full facts or figures does no favours to your credibility.

Toothsmith wrote:

By the time somone becomes proficient case assessment, treatment planning, surgery and the prosthetic build up that follows, the best part of £150 000 could easily have been spent.

Even if the the figure was true it still does not justify the 3700% mark up fee on the implant alone.

Inspiron wrote:

The amount of investment ( time and money ) it takes us to be well trained dental surgeons i think we should be able to charge 10x what we do.

Yeah right £25,000 for an implant! Affordable treatment for the patient is not on your agenda despite the fact he or she may have contributed to your education as a tax payer.

Inspiron wrote:

I have been only out of uni for a few years and post grad education has cost me approx 50k if u also take into acc time off work.

Then people complain that we charge what we do for out skills !

How much would the debts be if you don't take into account time off work as you were a student? I would imagine the difference will probably be living costs, student fees and beer money!

The only way people will stop complaining about how much dentists charges is when more and more people realise that they can cut costs by flying over to countries such as Hungary. Then the UK dentists will have to end their greed as well as their monopoly and compete on the free market.

Undisputedtruth

Toothsmith

Undisputedtruth wrote:

Again, you're unable to justify the 1500% mark up.

Undisputedtruth wrote:

Even if the the figure was true it still does not justify the 3700% mark up fee on the implant alone.

Make your mind up!

Any advance on 3700%? :rotfl:

Pennywise

Toothsmith wrote:

Alternatively, one could go on a couple of week course in either Scandenavia or the U.S (Depending on which system the dentist chose to use). The cost of this would be in the 10s of thousands

Just wondering, if the training costs are so prohibitively high, how can the dentists from the "cheaper" countries afford the courses and then go on to charge so little for the treatment compared with UK dentists. Are you saying they don't go on the same courses in Scandanavia or US to learn the skills or are they charged less?

Teerah

Education has many standards and thus different costs. In addition, cost of living varies in different countries, therefore the same dentists' charges that are being exhalted here may be seen as equally prohibitively expensive in other countries.

Teerah

Undisputedtruth wrote:

How much would the debts be if you don't take into account time off work as you were a student? I would imagine the difference will probably be living costs, student fees and beer money! Undisputedtruth

But inspiron states the education was post grad, therefore he was taking time off work to further his/her education.

Undisputedtruth wrote:

The only way people will stop complaining about how much dentists charges is when more and more people realise that they can cut costs by flying over to countries such as Hungary. Then the UK dentists will have to end their greed as well as their monopoly and compete on the free market.

Undisputedtruth

Hmmm... highly unlikely. Dont you think the cheapest option is actually to look after your teeth in the first place?