How do I approach the money issue...

Tropez

Hi,

I appreciate that to a certain extent I really should be using my own awareness of our relationship, though I feel I could use some independant advice on this one.

I have been in a relationship with a wonderful woman whom I absolutely adore for some time now. I feel that we are beginning to get to the stage where we move in together as she is spending more and more time at my house and less at her own. On the whole, our relationship is as close to perfect as I feel a relationship can be but there is one issue that causes some problems and that is money.

My girlfriend is a very independant individual, having moved out of her parents home almost as soon as she finished college, buying her own home, car and more recently starting her own business. Her business has struggled somewhat through the recession but she has persevered and kept it together and seems to be heading in a good direction. She tends to work rather long, unsociable hours though in order to keep her business ticking over as she is forced to see clients outside of normal working hours. This has had a negative impact on her social life and I can tell that sometimes she wonders whether it is all worth it - although, obviously, I try and support her as much as I can.

On the other hand, while I am also an independant person to some extent, I've never really had the same mentality and by my own admission the work that I do is extremely cushy. I work many fewer hours and receive a larger income than her. I have never personally considered this to be anything of an issue - afterall, what is money compared to love? - but it seems that I have been inadvertantly insensitive to her feelings. When we go out, I always make the assumption that I am paying - and I don't mean that in a bad way, it is just my nature to want to make her happy and relieve any financial burden she may be feeling. I have paid for bits and bobs related to her business needs such as anti-virus packages for her computer and carried out a few techy chores for her that she is incapable of doing, occasionally replacing some of her items with spares that I might have or on the odd occasions buying her necessary replacement items, none of which she has asked me to do, it's just something I've done because I felt it would help her out.

I haven't done this to be a flash !!!!! or anything, I have done it because I genuinely care for her and don't see the need for her to spend her own money on things that I can take care of with greater ease, especially during times when she has struggled with her business. But as I say, it appears that in doing so I have on occasion offended her and made her feel subordinate in some way which is not my intention whatsoever. She expressed her dislike of the way in which I automatically reach for my wallet whenever we are presented with a bill recently and it has given me cause for concern.

I see her point of view. She is used to being independant and not relying on anybody else and at the very least she wants our relationship to be an equal one. I also believe she is concerned that I might throw the "well I paid for it!" card into a disagreement one day, although I hope that I can convince her that I wouldn't.

This is why it concerns me that when she does make the permanent move into my house it may cause friction as until now I am obviously used to paying for all the bills and such and I honestly believe that she will expect to contribute towards them. In my eyes, I am happy to continue paying the bills - she would still be out of the house most of the day working, leaving most of the electric, gas, water etc. consumption down to me but I know that she isn't going to stand for this because she will want to pay her way.

Therefore, I was wondering if anybody had any advice on how I might approach this subject with her so as not to sound like a condescending jerk? Would it perhaps be an idea to set up a joint account with us both paying in a percentage of our income to pay for the general household bills thus leaving us with seperate accounts for our own stuff? Or should I just try and convince her that while her business is struggling I'm only looking out for her by paying for everything and we should review the whole situation a year or two from now when hopefully the outlook is clearer?

Has anybody else had similar experiences and found a solution that they may be able to share with me?

All input is welcome. Thank you.

xmaslolly76

As an independant type of person i can see where she is coming from if she has always fended for herself she probably feels uncomfortable with you paying for things all the time. I would sit down and have a serious talk about it all, i think the joint account idea is good with percentages put in based on each persons income. If her business is struggling and you really want to help could you not make your help more of a business deal so she sees you as an investor and not just bailing her out that way when business picks up she wouldnt feel so guilty as you would get your money back with profit?

samandona

She sounds like she's biting the hand that feeds her. I am in a similar position. My parnter earns more than I do although I am much better at dealing with money and bills. We have a joint account as we recently moved in together and as lolly suggested, we pay in what we can both reasonably afford. We are expecting a baby and I have bought alot of the baby-related things so far (cot, pram, clothes etc) but this was my choice and I know he would give me half the money if I asked him.

It is a difficult position for you -if you don't offer to pay you are being mean with your money but when you do offer to pay you make her feel like a subordinate. Sounds like she has an inferiority complex. If she earns enough money to look after herself anyway, then her contributing towards bills etc shouldn't be an issue for her. I would suggest sitting down and having a very frank conversation. If that fails, and she still won't see sense then I would recondier your decision to move in together. You sounds like a lovely caring guy, its a shame there arn't more people like you!

Tropez

xmaslolly76 wrote: »

As an independant type of person i can see where she is coming from if she has always fended for herself she probably feels uncomfortable with you paying for things all the time. I would sit down and have a serious talk about it all, i think the joint account idea is good with percentages put in based on each persons income. If her business is struggling and you really want to help could you not make your help more of a business deal so she sees you as an investor and not just bailing her out that way when business picks up she wouldnt feel so guilty as you would get your money back with profit?

Thank you for your reply.

I appreciate that I will have to speak with her at some point about this situation and I suppose I just want to have an idea of how and what to say when that time comes. I am glad that someone thinks that the joint account is a good idea because it is probably the only workable solution that I have come up with so far.

I haven't really ever bailed out her business per se, instead I have just contributed here and there. For instance, her work laptop went down with a virus which I cleared out and while doing so I discovered she had no anti-virus on it so I just took the liberty of installing some - obviously I explained what I did to her and she was thankful but I guess it is small things like this that are building up in her mind and I should have been more considerate I think.

I have considered offering to make an investment in her business though to give her a little more financial leeway but I would hate her to think I was trying to take over or suggesting that she is unable to succeed without me as I have no doubt she will succeed. I want to help her out with everything but I have to admit after she confronted me about me paying for everything I am scared of hurting her feelings more than I have apparently done already.

Tropez

samandona wrote: »

She sounds like she's biting the hand that feeds her. I am in a similar position. My parnter earns more than I do although I am much better at dealing with money and bills. We have a joint account as we recently moved in together and as lolly suggested, we pay in what we can both reasonably afford. We are expecting a baby and I have bought alot of the baby-related things so far (cot, pram, clothes etc) but this was my choice and I know he would give me half the money if I asked him.

It is a difficult position for you -if you don't offer to pay you are being mean with your money but when you do offer to pay you make her feel like a subordinate. Sounds like she has an inferiority complex. If she earns enough money to look after herself anyway, then her contributing towards bills etc shouldn't be an issue for her. I would suggest sitting down and having a very frank conversation. If that fails, and she still won't see sense then I would recondier your decision to move in together. You sounds like a lovely caring guy, its a shame there arn't more people like you!

Thanks for the reply. It is good to hear that the joint account works for you as I would hope that it could work for us too.

I don't think she would have any real problems taking care of our household bills but I would like to come to an arrangement whereby she doesn't feel that she's paying too little or too much. I figured the percentage of our incomes into a joint account would make the most sense as I would be racking up the majority of the bills anyway as I am at home most of the day. I don't know whether she would sell her property or keep it and let it out (no idea of mortgage or anything on it as it has never been any of my business) but I would imagine there is the prospect for some income to come from that for her which may help her manage her bills and maybe even aid her business.

Obviously, I want to get past this issue. I felt really bad when she confronted me with her feelings because I just never thought anything of it before but now that she has brought it up I feel I need to have something in place that we can both agree too.

Thank you for your input and congratulations on your pregnancy.

peachyprice

Tropez wrote: »

Thank you for your reply.

I appreciate that I will have to speak with her at some point about this situation and I suppose I just want to have an idea of how and what to say when that time comes. I am glad that someone thinks that the joint account is a good idea because it is probably the only workable solution that I have come up with so far.

The way forward is definitely communication, communication and more communication.

Before she moves in, sit down with her, with a spreadsheet showing all the household outgoings and discuss what she thinks is a fair contribution without railiroading her into feeling like you have already decided what she can afford. Let her make that decision based on honest figures.

A joint account for household outgoings is a good idea, but also keep your own accounts for independent spends. It will also give her the option to 'pay back' anything she feels you've spent on her unnecessarily, she can put a little extra into the house account without having to consult with you.

I would definitley hold back on investing in her business unless you are invited to do so. It's her baby, she won't want to feel like she needs your say so in the future when there are decisions to be made, so really, back off on this particular point, it will make her feel like you are trying to take over her life.

ERICS_MUM

First of all, you sound like a very nice caring man.

I think the joint account with you both contributing a percentage of your salary is a good idea, and I'd be surprised if your girlfriend doesn't go with it. I can understand how she feels about you always picking up the bill for nights out, perhaps you can split the bill most times but some times you can say "this is my treat". I also like the little things you do such as fitting the anti-virus software on her laptop. It might be that she has never had anyone care for her in this way and she feels "controlled". Cut back a bit & see if she feels more comfy. As I say, it would be nice to treat her occasionally - what woman doesn't like treats?

If all else fails, I'll send you my address - I'd love to be a kept woman !


Linda

PS good luck and let us know how you get on

Psykicpup

Tropez my dear what a lovely thoughtful guy you are - no I'm not being sarcastic - you actually realised why she is feeling (wrongly IMHO) a bit 'miffed'

I think the easiest way for you might to be showing her this post!

I definately would NOT offer to put money into her business tho, she will find this very imposing & threatening I'm afraid. I also would not be too keen on the whole joint account thing, I know I'm cynical but linking my finances with someone with a fledgling business......:eek:

As far as the finances go why not suggest she pays say 50% of what you pay on anything that will be increased by her being there. ie Tv licence fee wont change but your water bill if metered would, so if you pay £20 a month water ask her to pay a further £10 on it at least until you have a year of bills together so you can work out the true costs of living together.
If she feels she 'should' pay more, ask her to set up a savings account to save up for big treats - like a huge TV, a holiday (wedding :rotfl:) That way she is still contributing & indeed contributing in a way more towards the fun side of your relationship.

HTH

Oldernotwiser

What will she be doing with her home if she moves in with you; will it bring her in additional income?

Foggster

Firstly, you sound a really nice guy.

I consider myself to be pretty independent but feel your gf is being a bit over sensitive about things, but you have identified it so its best to try and strike a happy balance with her.

Joint account works for us. We both pay a % of our wage in each month and it pays for the bills and a little left over for "savings" for household stuff.

Can I ask what is going to happen to her house? Is it going to be sold or rented out?

ETA: Going by the times of the last few posts, great minds all thought alike at the same time!!! LOL

Tropez

peachyprice wrote: »

The way forward is definitely communication, communication and more communication.

Before she moves in, sit down with her, with a spreadsheet showing all the household outgoings and discuss what she thinks is a fair contribution without railiroading her into feeling like you have already decided what she can afford. Let her make that decision based on honest figures.

A joint account for household outgoings is a good idea, but also keep your own accounts for independent spends. It will also give her the option to 'pay back' anything she feels you've spent on her unnecessarily, she can put a little extra into the house account without having to consult with you.

I would definitley hold back on investing in her business unless you are invited to do so. It's her baby, she won't want to feel like she needs your say so in the future when there are decisions to be made, so really, back off on this particular point, it will make her feel like you are trying to take over her life.

Thank you. That sounds like sound advice regarding the spreadsheet. It would also give me an excuse to get back on top of the money management side. I've been perusing this site for a year and kept meaning to do a SoA so perhaps now would be a good time, although obviously I'll trim out all the unnecessary things that I buy if I present it to her.

And yes, I believe it would be necessary for us to maintain seperate accounts so that we can both maintain a degree of independance. I certainly wouldn't want her to feel that she couldn't buy herself a little something because the money was coming from a joint account afterall.

You have pretty much confirmed what I believed about how any offer to buy into her business would be received. I think it would be best if I just stuck to helping her out with the odd chore that needs doing, although perhaps advising her in advance of any cost it incurred to me so that she no longer feels insecure about it.