'Feeling empathy for Gordon' blog discussion

dizzie

Well, if Brown gets in again, I'll drown my sorrows...and then consider a move. Quite a few of our friends have emigrated to NZ or Australia. But closer to home, Scotland is a beautiful country - we spent most of our summer holidays there! Okay, I know the pressure on the public purse is greater now, so things may change, but to date if you live in Scotland, then I see that:

1. There are no University tuition fees
2. There are no prescription charges
3. There is free elderly care
4. Scottish councils have frozen council tax for the past three years

Mmm and then I remember that Brown and Darling are both from Scotland...and that makes me wonder - is it that these two are making sure that Scotland is well funded...or is it that Scotland was pleased to see Brown and Darling take up jobs in London since they had more competent politicians spending their budget at home?

PhylPho

dizzie wrote: »

Well, if Brown gets in again, I'll drown my sorrows...and then consider a move. Quite a few of our friends have emigrated to NZ or Australia. But closer to home, Scotland is a beautiful country - we spent most of our summer holidays there! Okay, I know the pressure on the public purse is greater now, so things may change, but to date if you live in Scotland, then I see that:

1. There are no University tuition fees
2. There are no prescription charges
3. There is free elderly care
4. Scottish councils have frozen council tax for the past three years

Nice idea, dizzie, but sorry: it ain't going to work. The unreal world of financing north of The Border -- where every resident is entitled to around £1,500 more from the public purse than any resident living south of The Border -- is coming to an end.

The only mystery is why this farce has gone on so long, seeing that even the guy who came up with the idea -- the then Labour Government's Treasury Chief Secretary Joel Barnett -- recently went on record to say he's baffled: "I only expected the extra payment per head of population to last around a year. Not more than 30."

(He was responding to the Liberal Democrats' Vince Cable's assertion that the "premium" was grossly unfair on non-Scots taxpayers and that the LibDems would abolish it if elected. So too, it seems, would the Conservatives. . . now.)

The LibDems' take on this issue is at least free of the hypocrisy that dogs the Conservatives: after all, Thatcher and Major were as desperate to curry favour in Scottish seats as Blair and Brown. Both Tory and Labour administrations have knowingly perpetuated a deliberately discriminatory policy just to win elections. (Well, nothing new there, then.)

Just how feather-bedded Scottish financial affairs have become as a result of "The Barnett Formula" is apparent from research recently undertaken by The Scottish Office.

It shows that since Scottish devolution in 1999, total spending by the UK and Scottish governments in Scotland was £399.9bn, made up from the so-called 'block grant' (as per The Barnett Formula), welfare benefits and tax credits provided directly by Westminster, and sundry proportionate fundings (for example, national defence.)

From 1999, total tax receipts generated in Scotland – excluding oil and gas, regarded as a UK national income stream to help fund, for example, the above-mentioned welfare benefits and tax credits emanating from Westminster – have totalled £324.157bn.

But Scotland has spent £75.78 billion more than that.

All those billions have come from the pockets of non-Scottish taxpayers.

Like you.

The over-spend -- in essence, it means that Scotland currently spends a quite staggering 145% of its 100% income -- has assured a fiscal Wonderland where public largesse is as bountiful as it gets: free university places? Hey: no problem! Better care for the elderly? Right on!

In fact: whatever the extra £1,500-per-year received by each Scottish taxpayer can buy. . . well, let's hear it. Otherwise how else is poor ol' Scotland going to spend its collective annual bonus? Wow, yes: it's great to live in Scotland. We're the cleverest economists of 'em all.

Predictably, the Scottish Parliament has fallen out with the Scottish Office over the statistics, claiming that oil and gas revenues generate £50 billion for the UK Exchequer -- the equivalent, says the Scottish Parliament, of £20,000 thrown into the UK pot by every Scottish household.

Er, well, um. . . If that is the case, then devolution included the assignment of any and all assets fortuitously located in, or relating to, the area north of The Border solely and exclusively to folks living north of The Border.

But it didn't. Otherwise any and all assets located in or relating to the area south of The Border would solely and exclusively be owned by those living here.

That asset includes the tax take: the comparatively huge income stream Westminster derives from English taxpayers compared to that derived by the Scottish Parliament from Scottish taxpayers. None of that asset should, on the basis of the Scottish Parliament's self-serving logic, be shared in any way with Scotland. But of course. . . It is.

Obviously, that now has to come to an end.

Labour's Scottish Raffia, which not only brought us the likes of John Reid (the guy, it will be remembered, who committed troops to Afghanistan on the basis that it would be a 'minimum risk' intervention of 'temporary duration'); Gordon Brown, the self-proclaimed Greatest Chancellor with no education or expertise in even basic Economics; Yvette Cooper, Brown's 'economics adviser' and loyal apparatchik married to the even more dazzlingly incompetent Ed Balls, the 'economist' upon Brown has so greatly depended to steer us into our current financial disaster; and Michael Martin, the now thankfully departed House of Commons Speaker who really does have to be one of the most odious figures ever to strut the political arena. . .

Is doomed.

As is The Barnett Formula.

By all means then, dizzie, head off to Scotland. But be aware that North of The Border, The Days of Wine & Roses are over.

And about time, too.

Old_Wrinkly

Labour, Conservative, and Liberal Democrats all have the following in their manifestos :
"Support tax-raising powers for Scottish Parliament".

The conclusion : Scotland to pay it's own way.

Possible rationale : To see how popular the SNP are when they can't rely on English handouts to fund socially-desirable policies.

PhylPho

Old_Wrinkly wrote: »

Labour, Conservative, and Liberal Democrats all have the following in their manifestos :
"Support tax-raising powers for Scottish Parliament".

The conclusion : Scotland to pay it's own way.

Possible rationale : To see how popular the SNP are when they can't rely on English handouts to fund socially-desirable policies.

It's going to come as a hell of a shock to the people of Scotland.

And especially as Scotland's Alice in Wonderland economics would never have been altered had not their very own famous Scottish son of the manse made Blunderland economics the penalty for living south of The Border.

:rotfl:

Mankysteve

It was a deliberately attempt by sky to catch him out. Normally a sound tech will remove the mike before they get into the car. Sky and Rubert Murdoch are not on labour side hes just after a chuck of the beeb.


Doesn't really matter who you vote for there all going to have to put up tax/cut public spending anyway.

ManyDollarz

I had to laugh... I've just been reading through GB's expenses receipts online and noticed he has many, many receipts for having his grass cut in Kirkcaldy, at £35 a pop. And these have a wonderful title at the top of each reciept...

"Helping The Community To Help Themselves"

Honestly, you couldn't make it up! Never a truer word said. Not since Sainsburys' "Good food costs less, when it's stolen"!

h ttp://mpsallowances.parliament.uk/mpslordsandoffices/hocallowances/allowances-by-mp/gordon-brown/

ManyDollarz

GB's main Election mistake, of course, was not to use his real name: Dr. James Brown. :cool:

'The Godfather of Tax'!

Fellas, I'm ready to get up and do my thing! (Yeah! That's right! Do it!)
I want to get into it, man, you know? (Go ahead! Yeah!)
Like a, like a tax machine, man, (Yeah!)
movin', doin' it, y'know? (Yeah!)
Can I count it off? (Okay! Alright!)
One, two, three, four million out of work!

Paul_Herring

Mankysteve wrote: »

It was a deliberately attempt by sky to catch him out. Normally a sound tech will remove the mike before they get into the car.

Rubbish. Look up Hanlon's razor.

Not that I'm trying to indicate on which side the stupidity lies.

yourbrother1975

I was not a huge fan of GB, but to be honest recently, I have changed my mind on this.

This man has had every C*** thrown at him and he is still standing. I actually feel really really sorry for him. And for that reason alone, I will be voting Labour this time. I don't know if that is the reason why the mum's net poll suggested they vote NC and then GB before DC. I can't believe all the media are ganging up on this man, and the most surprising thing is he still has the chance and he is still standing.

To make things interesting, Tories had 33% share of votes last election and the opinion polls shows more or less the same numbers this time.

So the new image, money, message of change has done nothing to improve their rating. If Tories did not win this time I don't know when they will. Only if GB had half the support of the media, he might have won the election.

Premier_2

ManyDollarz wrote: »

I had to laugh... I've just been reading through GB's expenses receipts online and noticed he has many, many receipts for having his grass cut in Kirkcaldy, at £35 a pop. And these have a wonderful title at the top of each reciept...

"Helping The Community To Help Themselves"

Honestly, you couldn't make it up! Never a truer word said. Not since Sainsburys' "Good food costs less, when it's stolen"!

http://mpsallowances.parliament.uk/mpslordsandoffices/hocallowances/allowances-by-mp/gordon-brown/

I wish you hadn't posted that link :eek:

In the interests of fair play & balance, I thought I'd take a quick look at the other 2 leader's claims.

First, Mr 'Squeaky Clean' Nick Clegg.
I see in December 2006 he claimed for a nice new fitted kitchen costing you and me £2600 (plus another £170+ of unreceipted kitchen costs - presumably the cake tins Cameron was alluding to)
But I'm thinking of starting up a gardening services company in Sheffield. I see he claims £160 per month for gardening ... every month!
Now around here, gardeners charge about £10 per hour and whilst they may do about 4 hours per fortnight in peak growing season, I'm not sure what a gardener would do for 4 hours per week in the dormant season?
And this isn't anything special - just cutting grass, trimming hedge, weeding, etc.
In fact in July/August 2006, he claimed for a whopping £1640 gardening expenses alone - again nothing special, just lawn mowing, hedge cutting, etc plus a bit of pruning!

So how much does Mr 'Call me Dave' Cameron claim from the likes of you and me?
Well at first sight, there doesn't seem to be anything too outrageous (but then I haven't looked at anyone's claims too deeply).
But what is somewhat excessive is his energy bills, even if they are all receipted.
For the year 2008-2009, he is claiming approximately £200 per month (so about £2400 per year) in gas & electricity. That's twice the national average household energy costs and remember this is supposed to be his second home.
Well, second home or hot, it is in band G council tax, and presumably where his wife & kids live so I suppose that might just be acceptable ... until you then notice a further £1200 bill (£800+ and £300+) for heating oil for that year.
Perhaps he should start using a few of those 200 million free low energy light bulbs the energy companies distributed?

I don't know about 'I agree with Nick', but I'm beginning to think 'I agree with Gillian' - now too disillusioned to vote.


Edit: Btw, it looks like Gordon Brown's grass cutting bills of £35 are only per month and only during the growing season.