Bristish Gas Engineer refusing to go on roof.

ben500

gavjbrown wrote: »

Thanks for the replies, I'm will to put scaffolding up but dont know anything about it or what would be acceptable to them.

Anyway just been informed now by a lady from BG that the flue inst covered on the homecare policy. Even though we had the same part replaced 2 years ago and just this we we have had 2 visits from BG engineers, one of which even brought the part along.

So now even we scaffolding she's saying the wont fit it.

If they agreed to fit it during a telephone call then ask them to review the call, all their calls are recorded and can be accessed simply within one working day, if they review the call and it confirms the offer to replace has been made they will honour it.
As for scaffold you don't need to know yourself what the requirments are the scaffold company will assess the job and provide the appropriate equipment as required, they will also issue a handing over/safety certificate declaring the structure sound. I wouldn't be paying for it yourself though if I were you, if BG refuse to stump up then you should consult your home insurers who may well do, this would not be classed as a maintenance issue as it is the result of a breakdown.
These tradesmen have made a legitimate assessment that the work cannot be safely carried out without scaffold, the ridge angles would not allow for safe positioning of a ladder in order to access the area around the flue, yes it could be done without scaffold but only at risk, we may choose to assess and dismiss any risk if doing the job ourselves but it is unfair to impose risk on another worker.

Lube

Same way it was fitted originally

ben500 wrote: »

How would you secure a ladder to that roof in order to access the flue out of interest?

Blackpool_Saver

Even I would go up there with a ladder, BUT they have to work within THEIR guidelines....

macman

You're getting off the point .They didn't say 'we can't replace that flue without scaffolding, so we'll have to order it and come back'. They just said 'we can't do that job at all';. and then BG phoned later to claim that the flue was not covered anyway.
If it is covered under the policy, it's up to BT to supply a means of access within their safety guidelines, regardless of the cost.

ben500

macman wrote: »

You're getting off the point .They didn't say 'we can't replace that flue without scaffolding, so we'll have to order it and come back'. They just said 'we can't do that job at all';. and then BG phoned later to claim that the flue was not covered anyway.
If it is covered under the policy, it's up to BT to supply a means of access within their safety guidelines, regardless of the cost.

Only in your head they did not according to the op, perhaps you'd like to read it again?

It's BG by the way and I agree they should foot the bill, but I also agree that the flue is unsafe to acccess by ladder as there is no point that would provide sufficient purchase to ensure safe operation, the tradesman is required to apply a harness when working above the height of 9' which was the previous minimum height at which safety equipment was required to be utilised, recently the minimum was abolished that is what my original post identified not that there is no safety requirement as some have commented.

ben500

Lube wrote: »

Same way it was fitted originally

The question was how would a ladder be applied to the roof to enable safe access to the flue. You haven't answered it yet quoted my post, perhaps you'd like to look at the photo and explain a safe method and point of siting which would enable a tradesman to work unhindered? You may wish to take risks with your own health but as I said earlier you don't have any right to impose risk on someone else. If it wa my roof and my flue I would probably do my best to access via ladder also but it's my risk nobody elses.

macman

ben500 wrote: »

Only in your head they did not according to the op, perhaps you'd like to read it again?

It's BG by the way and I agree they should foot the bill, but I also agree that the flue is unsafe to acccess by ladder as there is no point that would provide sufficient purchase to ensure safe operation, the tradesman is required to apply a harness when working above the height of 9' which was the previous minimum height at which safety equipment was required to be utilised, recently the minimum was abolished that is what my original post identified not that there is no safety requirement as some have commented.

I'm not suggesting that they were wrong to refuse to try and access it there and then, I'm objecting to the fact that they said to the OP 'if you provide the scaffolding then we might do it! Accessing it is BG's responsibility.
And then subsequently BG try and wriggle out of any responsibility by claiming that the flue is not covered.

duggie1982

The flu is not covered under homecare (was 2 years ago when there was a change in 'corgi regulations' for a limited time. But BG should provide up to £1000 to get to the problem.

Hope this helps.

shandypants5

ben500 wrote: »

How would you secure a ladder to that roof in order to access the flue out of interest?

OK firstly let me say that I am not saying anyone should take risks at work and if they dont feel safe then thats up to them.

THAT particular job though is an easy reach and if the tradesmen didnt feel up to it, then I think that reflects on THEM and not the job.

If I had to get up there.

1) I would fist lean a ladder against the building directly under the flue and at the correct angle, with the wide bracing wheels adjusted down the ladder to press against against some solid brickwork under the guttering.
This would leave about 7 feet of ladder projecting up above the roof level.

2) I would then secure this ladder to the building by drilling and fixing one or more eyebolts to the house and feeding a ratchet strap through the ladder rungs and the eyebolts so that it pulled at a 90 deg angle to the ladder. (personally I would use 2 on that job, either side of the door)
This enables the ladder to be pulled TIGHT against the building and ground and form a VERY stable ladder that CANNOT slip and CANNOT fall sideways.
(on a very high job I might do this at head hight and then again higher up the ladder.)

3) Now that I can get up to the roof (wearing a harness if I like).
I can install a crawling ladder to lay flat on the tiles, to the right of the flue.
Personally I would just lay it on THAT roof and secure it to the top of my now solid ladder with a strap. (the roof is shallow and the crawler is not likely to slip anyway)
BUT for the sake of safety and a harness clipping point, I could throw a rope or strap over the roof at the low point of the apex, and secure this to the building over the other side using another eyebolt.
If required (on a high job) this could be used to assist hauling the crawler up to the roof)
This strap would be fixed securely to the top end of the crawler before laying it on the roof and also the slack trailing end threaded thru the crawler and fixed to the top of the upright ladder once everything was in place.
On THIS job it wouldnt need to be used as a tight support, it is only there to anchor the crawler and therefore the harness in case of a fall.

4) I can now climb the ladder untill my feet are at roof level (stopping to transfer my harness as I pas the crawler)
Then I can step sideways onto the crawler that is bound tightly next to my ladder, while using the upright ladder as a hand hold.

If I was really scared I would put a similar arrangement up near the chimney where I could hook the crawler over the apex in the normal way.
This would enable me to climb and anchor this securely by binding around the chimney stack.
This crawler could then be used to bind ropes or straps to help stabilise the "working platform" crawlers.

In all honestly for this job, I personally wouldnt bother with crawlers. I would just secure the upright ladder with a strap and then sit on the roof drinking tea and hanging the job out depending on the weather.:o its nice on the roof in the summer.

gavjbrown

Thanks everyone, as soon as I get a response from them I will let you know.

Some great advice and Info.

Gav